The Importance of Hard Barrier Penetration
- Thread starter Marine Cpl
- Start date
Acer-m14
20×102mm Vulcan
wounder how my 44cal BP colt will do when i throw it LOL FUAC ...
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
I would carry one too if the caliber was more popular and readily available. I have since settled on 9mm going in at about 175 fps less.
I'll say it again:
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
For hollow points those Gold Dots are amongst the best along with the TSX/ DPX/ TTSX bullets in my opinion.
I still prefer solid bullets that do not fragment or expand though for the added penetration after going through a barrier and striking flesh afterwards.
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When purchased from PSA those 223 Gold Dots are less than half the price of any solid copper round I've seen.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Have you looked at the 75 gr? They are just a little, tiny bit more expensive and penetrate deeper.
PSA=Palmetto State Armory
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
gun_slinger_boy
.338 Win Mag
45 is all I need
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
That beats a .44 Magnum right?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
That doesn't work if the target is in a vehicle, behind a bar, taking cover behind a metal garbage can, ECT.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
What do you think? It is like a rifle round but from a 6" pistol. lol
The 44 mag is a great brush round though specially for a compact carbine like a 16" lever.
357mag with heavies also very nice.
But different goals and different context.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
I think the op implied when some sort of hard barrier is in the middle.
Like auto glass that with modern cars and shallow angles can actually be something very hard to overcome.
After shootouts forensics have found rounds like a 180gr 40S&W sitting in the back seat.
It has nothing to do with the lack of power or grain that otherwise could be very effective but the lack of speed and perhaps
stoutness of the bullet. The same can happen to a 45, a heavy 9mm, a 38spc round, etc...
That is why cartriges, ammo and tactics have evolved to also be effective when presented with such situations so one can connect
with the target. When this is possible many calibers and bullets can do a good job given good placement like you suggested.
$12.99 per box for the 75gr vs $9.99 per box for the 64gr. Plus they don't advertise free shipping for 10+ boxes for the 75s like the do for the 64s. All three flavors of the 223 Gold Dot line are well regarded so therfore I will opt for the cheapest variety. But I should compare POIs of the 75gr Gold Dots against the 77gr IMI OTMs I'm stocking.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
..and btw you have the 35 auto mag derived from the 44 auto mag.
Pistols for those needed a wheel barrel. Same makers that did the 30 carbine and a few other calibers
like the coonan ..
357 automag derived from the 44 automag.
In similar way the dillon comes from the 10mm but more powder, more pressure, more speed... too much imo.
357 automag next to the parent..
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
If it were me, if spend the extra 3 to 5 bucks a box to get more penetration. But that's just me.
The SPG 75gr rounds a quite slow for .223/5.55. While it delivers admirable terminal performance on soft targets I wonder if its hard barrier penetration suffers as a result? Either way when it comes to ammo I prefer volume over all else, to a point. I'm not stocking cheap M855 for example.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Well in that video above, it had no problem going through a windshield at 2300 fps out of an 11.5 inch barrel while still penetrating 22 inches. The 75 gr Hornady TAP rounds used by law enforcement have no such issues with car doors and the like.
I guess I should test some then. I just wish I had more than 200 yards and a good scope so I could do a proper evaluation.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Why would you need a scope for your 75 or 77gr? Just zero your Red Dot at 50 and you are good within a few inches up to 200 unless you are planning on engaging targets at further.
I'vent come to the conclusion that heavy 5.56/.223 bullets don't really come into their own until after 400 yds. And that's about the extent of my intended range. Once I get the forum lower build sorted I'll get a nice scope and turn the DD into a nice recce carbine.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Thpse tests are a joke. in any case the gold dot, while not well optimized for carbines in order to be faster still uses pretty decent and stout bullets so the average barrier is not a problem.
They are well priced too
Any 62gr solid or thick jacker fmj will be good too. M885 is cheap too. The key is speed on the target and solid, thick jacket, bomded or penetrtors to avoid or minimize fragmentation in hard barrier pass through. This migt also mean less deflection. Also check the bh 77gr. Tmk. Amazing round and external balistics.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
But they do well enough at close range too. With a 16 inch barrel, you are doing about 2700 fps compared to about 3000 fps from a 62 gr.
How are the .223 Gold Dots not optimised for carbines? I thought they were expressly intended for duty use in ARs which means carbines. And I thought soft points in general relied less on velocity for terminal effect than FMJs?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Why are the tests a joke? Firing through a windshield and then through calibrated ballistic gelatin is a joke?
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
This channel is known to show conflicting and incomplete info.
one needs to follow a method.
What windshield, what car and year.
Does it match the angle as installed in the vehicle?
what is the temperature? Is the gel really calibrated?
We have clothes and bones, where are they?
What about shooting from 50 and 100 yards?
Nobody shoots a car from 8ft away.
So many things missing...
I think it might give an initial idea but not answers