United fires almost 600 workers for not getting the jab.

[spat]

You can sue your employer, but unless you proved their negligence such as not providing proper PPE or proper training for the hazmat, you'd lose. Just getting mesothelioma alone isn't enough to hold a party guilty, you'd need to prove that they caused it.

Court affirms dismissal of verdict against Ford in asbestos case

New York’s highest court on Tuesday affirmed dismissal of an $11 million jury verdict against Ford Motor Co. in connection with an auto mechanic’s death from asbestosis.

www.businessinsurance.com

The context of this discussion was a vaccine related injury.

Presumably you would have sufficient evidence that your injury was related to the vaccine your employer mandated.

The government has indemnified itself and the manufacturers from liability for such injuries, but not employers.

That *should* make these mandates a massive risk for the employers. There *will* be huge numbers of such injuries, and that leaves the employers as the only deep pocket left to go after.

Imagine if health insurers decided they didn't want to foot that bill alone ?

 

[Defilade]

The context of this discussion was a vaccine related injury.

Presumably you would have sufficient evidence that your injury was related to the vaccine your employer mandated.

The government has indemnified itself and the manufacturers from liability for such injuries, but not employers.

That *should* make these mandates a massive risk for the employers. There *will* be huge numbers of such injuries, and that leaves the employers as the only deep pocket left to go after.

Imagine if health insurers decided they didn't want to foot that bill alone ?

Exactly right. Being that none of this shit is Law. Mandates, Guidelines, Policies are Liable by the one in charge of imposing such. Go after them personally and hold them Liable.

 

[Dr. Evil]

I would also like to add that if they are trying to 'protect their employees' by requiring the vaccine, they're targeting the wrong group. Most people who die from covid are well beyond working age.

I suppose they are protecting their employees when they tell remote employees that sit in their home/apartment and don't work on site they need to have the jab? Should they walk around their homes with a mask too just in case?

 

[SonOfSun]

The context of this discussion was a vaccine related injury.

You used asbestos as an example, so the reply was within context of the addition to the conversation.

Presumably you would have sufficient evidence that your injury was related to the vaccine your employer mandated.

Lawsuits work on the exact opposite of presumption. You would need to show sufficient evidence, it's not presumed that you have it just by bringing a case. Countless lawsuits get dismissed every year for lack of evidence.

The government has indemnified itself and the manufacturers from liability for such injuries, but not employers.

That *should* make these mandates a massive risk for the employers. There *will* be huge numbers of such injuries, and that leaves the employers as the only deep pocket left to go after.

Imagine if health insurers decided they didn't want to foot that bill alone ?

The liability part is sort of BS, but you'd have a hard time arguing in court that a business is responsible for a negative outcome based on an FDA approved path. For sake of argument, lets say someone is harmed by the vaccine.... these companies will argue that their requirements were in line with national medical guidelines and best practices to keep their employee pool healthy and minimize risk of covid spread/death. Chances are this would get any case tossed if they can show proof of enforcing the guidelines. Whether you or I agree or disagree with it is moot, it's just how it would play out in court.

 

[spat]

You used asbestos as an example, so the reply was within context of the addition to the conversation.

Yes, if your employer requires you to work in an asbestos laden building, that is the equivalent to making you take a side effect laden vaccine.

Lawsuits work on the exact opposite of presumption. You would need to show sufficient evidence, it's not presumed that you have it just by bringing a case. Countless lawsuits get dismissed every year for lack of evidence.

The presumption is that the case wouldn't be brought unless you already had that evidence.

Obviously you would present it.

The liability part is sort of BS, but you'd have a hard time arguing in court that a business is responsible for a negative outcome based on an FDA approved path. For sake of argument, lets say someone is harmed by the vaccine.... these companies will argue that their requirements were in line with national medical guidelines and best practices to keep their employee pool healthy and minimize risk of covid spread/death. Chances are this would get any case tossed if they can show proof of enforcing the guidelines. Whether you or I agree or disagree with it is moot, it's just how it would play out in court.

I am sure they would do the same for their asbestos mitigation strategy.

Most of those suits are settled at great expense to the employer, not dismissed outright.

 

[Defilade]

You used asbestos as an example, so the reply was within context of the addition to the conversation.


Lawsuits work on the exact opposite of presumption. You would need to show sufficient evidence, it's not presumed that you have it just by bringing a case. Countless lawsuits get dismissed every year for lack of evidence.




The liability part is sort of BS, but you'd have a hard time arguing in court that a business is responsible for a negative outcome based on an FDA approved path. For sake of argument, lets say someone is harmed by the vaccine.... these companies will argue that their requirements were in line with national medical guidelines and best practices to keep their employee pool healthy and minimize risk of covid spread/death. Chances are this would get any case tossed if they can show proof of enforcing the guidelines. Whether you or I agree or disagree with it is moot, it's just how it would play out in court.

Not a Law! The employers CHOOSE to follow a guideline, policy. They are liable. No one is forcing the employer. Lol once again, Not a Law.

 

[Vinson57]

Mandates are illegal, totally no matter what, there should be no budge here. Be a lawyer here, NYers like to play the losing side on everything like whipped dogs. The vaccines do not work and they cover this up by censorship of the data, use propaganda and continued enforcement of the mitigation measures. They only let up was they permitted less mask wear just to give a little. The mitigation techniques cover the vaccine failure and all the vax holes are scared of braking them rules. They are not safe and effective and they do not prevent catching covid and then passing it off. Asymptomatic corvid is another lie, it just means you were caught up in a false positive test. Vaxholes, you can't trust any of them now. They lined up for the shot and they also are un-American and do not care and its all part of a personality defect.

 

[Uninformed and Compliant]

minimize risk of covid spread/death

It'd be adorable for them to make that argument after being asked if they required masks. It'd be pretty tough to beat a preponderance standard after such stupidity.

 

[holdover]

They aren't making you do it. It's not like they are holding you down and sticking a needle in your arm. You can quit and go elsewhere if you don't like it. Start your own business, you can set the requirements - no vaccine, no problem. Heck, you could even make a rule, no vaccinated employees. Your business, your rules.

No Sir, Its called coercion. The application of pressure. Nobody is holding me down, they are threating me with the loss of my livihood . key word is threat.

coercion
[kōˈərZHən, kōˈərSHən]

NOUN

1. the practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats.
   "our problem cannot be solved by any form of coercion but only by agreement"
   synonyms:
   force · compulsion · constraint · duress · oppression · enforcement · harassment · intimidation · threats · insistence · demand · arm-twisting · pressure · pressurization · influence
   
   
   
   Coercion is codified as a duress crime. Such actions are used as leverage, to force the victim to act in a way contrary to their own interests. Coercion may involve the actual infliction of physical pain/injury or psychological harm in order to enhance the credibility of a threat.
   Coercion - Wikipedia
   
   
2. coercion(noun) the act of compelling by force of authority. Synonyms: compulsion. compulsion, coercion(noun) using force to cause something to occur.
   
   
   
3. duress
   [d(y)o͝oˈres]
   
   NOUN
   1. threats, violence, constraints, or other action brought to bear on someone to do something against their will or better judgment.
   2. 
      
   3. 
      
   4. 
      
   5. 
      
   6. While duress involves threats and coercion to force someone to enter into a contract, undue influence involves the taking advantage of someone through a position of trust. Undue influence can only be exerted by someone in a superior position, or who has a duty to advise the other. When the superior party applies excessive pressure on the other to agree to something he otherwise would not do, it is considered undue influence.
      Duress - Definition, Examples, Cases, Processes
      
      Part of being a leader is being responsible, and accountable for your actions. (Not that you can find it in our government but nonetheless) If you coerce someone into taking a shot, and they get sick from it, you cant just wash your hands and say Well im not responsible they did it of thier own free will when they didnt. You cannot absolve yourself from the responsibility. When it was you who forced it.Thats like forceing some to choose between 3 doors and tell them behind one is a lion behind 2 is fire and behind 3 there is nothing ,then claiming they walked though the door by thier own choice so I have nothing to do with it.
   7. 
      Its not free will. and its not good leadership. Its tyranny style leadership with no accountability.
      
      
   8. Its not free will.

(stolen from Defilade)
A. Forced vaccinations violate:

- The Nuremberg War Crimes Code.
- The Geneva Convention.
- The UN Charter.
- The international Criminal Court Laws.
- The US Constitution.
- The Declaration of Geneva

 

[SonOfSun]

No Sir, Its called coercion. The application of pressure. Nobody is holding me down, they are threating me with the loss of my livihood . key word is threat.

coercion
[kōˈərZHən, kōˈərSHən]

NOUN

1. the practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats.
   "our problem cannot be solved by any form of coercion but only by agreement"
   synonyms:
   force · compulsion · constraint · duress · oppression · enforcement · harassment · intimidation · threats · insistence · demand · arm-twisting · pressure · pressurization · influence
   
   
   
   Coercion is codified as a duress crime. Such actions are used as leverage, to force the victim to act in a way contrary to their own interests. Coercion may involve the actual infliction of physical pain/injury or psychological harm in order to enhance the credibility of a threat.
   Coercion - Wikipedia
   
   
2. coercion(noun) the act of compelling by force of authority. Synonyms: compulsion. compulsion, coercion(noun) using force to cause something to occur.
   
   
   
3. duress
   [d(y)o͝oˈres]
   
   NOUN
   1. threats, violence, constraints, or other action brought to bear on someone to do something against their will or better judgment.
   2. 
      
   3. 
      
   4. 
      
   5. 
      
   6. While duress involves threats and coercion to force someone to enter into a contract, undue influence involves the taking advantage of someone through a position of trust. Undue influence can only be exerted by someone in a superior position, or who has a duty to advise the other. When the superior party applies excessive pressure on the other to agree to something he otherwise would not do, it is considered undue influence.
      Duress - Definition, Examples, Cases, Processes
      
      Part of being a leader is being responsible, and accountable for your actions. (Not that you can find it in our government but nonetheless) If you coerce someone into taking a shot, and they get sick from it, you cant just wash your hands and say Well im not responsible they did it of thier own free will when they didnt. You cannot absolve yourself from the responsibility. When it was you who forced it.Thats like forceing some to choose between 3 doors and tell them behind one is a lion behind 2 is fire and behind 3 there is nothing ,then claiming they walked though the door by thier own choice so I have nothing to do with it.
   7. 
      Its not free will. and its not good leadership. Its tyranny style leadership with no accountability.
      
      
   8. Its not free will.

(stolen from Defilade)
A. Forced vaccinations violate:

- The Nuremberg War Crimes Code.
- The Geneva Convention.
- The UN Charter.
- The international Criminal Court Laws.
- The US Constitution.
- The Declaration of Geneva

Moot point. You are likely an at will employee, at least most people are. They can fire you for any reason. IE. "That shirt is ugly so you're fired, now GTFO."

In United States labor law, at-will employment is an employer's ability to dismiss an employee for any reason, and without warning, as long as the reason is not illegal. When an employee is acknowledged as being hired "at will," courts deny the employee any claim for loss resulting from the dismissal.

Requiring a vaccination is NOT illegal. You CAN have employment terminated if you choose not to be vaccinated.

 

[holdover]

Moot point. You are likely an at will employee, at least most people are. They can fire you for any reason. IE. "That shirt is ugly so you're fired, now GTFO."

In United States labor law, at-will employment is an employer's ability to dismiss an employee for any reason, and without warning, as long as the reason is not illegal. When an employee is acknowledged as being hired "at will," courts deny the employee any claim for loss resulting from the dismissal.

Requiring a vaccination is NOT illegal. You CAN have employment terminated if you choose not to be vaccinated.

Your talking apples and oranges. Yes of course you can be fired at will. thats not the problem.

The problem is liability due to employers requirements which have caused injury. Not a moot point.

 

[holdover]

Your stupidity caused someone to be injured then its on you to compensate them for it.

 

[holdover]

Slavery is the use of force to compel obedience .

Coercion is the practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats.

Rule by Coercion is slavery.

If slaves dont obey, slaves dont eat. Do you see it yet?

 

[holdover]

 

[spat]

Moot point. You are likely an at will employee, at least most people are. They can fire you for any reason. IE. "That shirt is ugly so you're fired, now GTFO."

In United States labor law, at-will employment is an employer's ability to dismiss an employee for any reason, and without warning, as long as the reason is not illegal. When an employee is acknowledged as being hired "at will," courts deny the employee any claim for loss resulting from the dismissal.

Requiring a vaccination is NOT illegal. You CAN have employment terminated if you choose not to be vaccinated.

Sleeping with your secretary is not illegal either.

But telling her she's fired if she doesn't cooperate is.

 

[SonOfSun]

Sleeping with your secretary is not illegal either.

But telling her she's fired if she doesn't cooperate is.

Big difference; Forcing sexual favors is illegal. Private employer vaccine requirements aren't illegal.

You can terminate at will employees for any reason as long as it's not illegal.

 

[Defilade]

Big difference; Forcing sexual favors is illegal. Private employer vaccine requirements aren't illegal.

You can terminate at will employees for any reason as long as it's not illegal.

Discrimination. Better stated, Medical discrimination.

New Workplace Discrimination and Harassment Protections | New York State Division of Human Rights

Initiatives | Press Releases | Publications | Local Human Rights Commissions | Statistics | Videos New Workplace Discrimination and Harassment Protections New legislation strengthened protections against discrimination and harassment, including sexual harassment, in the New York State Human...

dhr.ny.gov

 

[Defilade]

 

[Defilade]

View attachment mandate.MP4

 

[Defilade]

Employers cannot mandate something that is known to kill and injure people. That is already established.

 

[spat]

Big difference; Forcing sexual favors is illegal. Private employer vaccine requirements aren't illegal.

You can terminate at will employees for any reason as long as it's not illegal.

Sexual favors are not illegal.

Only *coercing* people into sexual favors is illegal.

Making sex a term of employment isn't illegal either. There's an entire industry built around filming it.

But coercing it is.

 

[MothMan]

Your stupidity caused someone to be injured then its on you to compensate them for it.

Layman’s term for negligence?

 

[MothMan]

Embarrassingly well said sir.

NYers like to play the losing side on everything like whipped dogs.

 

[Bob]

I received an email less than 90 minutes ago from my company's Chief Human Resources Officer. We are being required to have the jab because we are a federal contractor.

These are the two links that were provided. I have not yet read them completely.

Executive Order on Ensuring Adequate COVID Safety Protocols for Federal Contractors | The White House

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including the Federal Property and

www.whitehouse.gov

https://www.saferfederalworkforce.gov/downloads/Draft%20contractor%20guidance%20doc_20210922.pdf

Word came down officially through my management chain last night and this morning.

"Vaccination is a condition of employment. Failure to submit proof of full vaccination by Dec 8th, without having an approved medical or religious exemption, is a policy violation leading to termination effective Dec 9th."

As not being vaccinated is considered a policy violation, separation from the company will be considered "termination for cause" and unemployment claims will be denied. Termination for cause will also eliminate any chances of ever being rehired by the company or any of it's subsidiaries.

All doses of any of the three approved shots must be completed no later than November 24.

Applications for medical or religious exemptions must be submitted before November 19th. They will be reviewed by a board and will be approved or denied. Any approved exemptions are temporary and must be renewed at regular intervals.

Contractors MUST provide proof of vaccination or they will not be allowed onsite. No accommodations will be made for religious or medical exemptions for contractors.

 

[spat]

Word came down officially through my management chain last night and this morning.

"Vaccination is a condition of employment. Failure to submit proof of full vaccination by Dec 8th, without having an approved medical or religious exemption, is a policy violation leading to termination effective Dec 9th."

As not being vaccinated is considered a policy violation, separation from the company will be considered "termination for cause" and unemployment claims will be denied. Termination for cause will also eliminate any chances of ever being rehired by the company or any of it's subsidiaries.

All doses of any of the three approved shots must be completed no later than November 24.

Applications for medical or religious exemptions must be submitted before November 19th. They will be reviewed by a board and will be approved or denied. Any approved exemptions are temporary and must be renewed at regular intervals.

Contractors MUST provide proof of vaccination or they will not be allowed onsite. No accommodations will be made for religious or medical exemptions for contractors.

Apply for unemployment anyway.

Make them fight it.

It will cost them more to fight than it will to just let you have it.

If everyone who is fired fights it, they don't have enough lawyers.

 

[Defilade]

Word came down officially through my management chain last night and this morning.

"Vaccination is a condition of employment. Failure to submit proof of full vaccination by Dec 8th, without having an approved medical or religious exemption, is a policy violation leading to termination effective Dec 9th."

As not being vaccinated is considered a policy violation, separation from the company will be considered "termination for cause" and unemployment claims will be denied. Termination for cause will also eliminate any chances of ever being rehired by the company or any of it's subsidiaries.

All doses of any of the three approved shots must be completed no later than November 24.

Applications for medical or religious exemptions must be submitted before November 19th. They will be reviewed by a board and will be approved or denied. Any approved exemptions are temporary and must be renewed at regular intervals.

Contractors MUST provide proof of vaccination or they will not be allowed onsite. No accommodations will be made for religious or medical exemptions for contractors.

Fight it. Show them how it is not LAW and sue them for Wrongful Termination. Mandating a shot that has killed thousands and harmed many more in flat out wrong!