Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
now your breaking a FED law .. having someone else help you make a 80 into a gun .. you know .. the law that ended build parties ..
"Ghost guns" A-9903A amended ( merged with senate ghost gun thread)
- Thread starter gunpoliticsny
- Start date
now your breaking a FED law .. having someone else help you make a 80 into a gun .. you know .. the law that ended build parties ..
dean3690
.45 acp
Please enlighten me about Federal laws prohibiting hiring someone to engrave/serialize a finished or an unfinished receiver. You can purchase an unfinished receiver with serialization from some manufacturer's. An unfinished receiver with or without serialization is a door stop at present under current NYS law and anyone can engrave it or serialize it which does not help you make it into a gun.
I'm not suggesting that you have anyone do anything to your unfinished receiver to help you make it a gun unless you want to get an FFL involved to help with some part of the milling or build.
I'm not suggesting that you have anyone do anything to your unfinished receiver to help you make it a gun unless you want to get an FFL involved to help with some part of the milling or build.
gun_slinger_boy
.338 Win Mag
I use these guys to engrave SBRs and silencers for me. Not against federal law.
laserworxonline.com
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Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
there goes home depot and lowes .. pipe section ..
Ok, please 'splain this to me like I'm stupid. I'm not a lawyer, and I don't claim to be related to Einstein, but I am reasonably intelligent.
Let's just ASSUME that someone had in their posession, one or more AR type rifles that they themselves [ LEGALLY ] manufactured from an 80% receiver. That rifle has no serial number, no caliber designation, and no manufacturer's name on it, nor does it have any date of manufacture, or any paperwork to establish the fact that it was indeed LEGAL at the time of manufacture. Now let's ASSUME that this person wanted to make his or her previously legal rifle(s) compliant with these new laws. Just engraving some random numbers on the receiver(s) would not make them compliant. Taking the receiver(s) to a 07 FFL would not likely result in compliance either, since the FFL DID NOT MANUFACTURE and therefore would probably not be likely to place upon the receiver(s) all the markings needed to make them legal, thus subjecting themselves to assuming responsibility for a defective firearm.
So, HOW exactly is someone supposed to comply (assuming they wanted to ) ?
Robin
.475 A&M Magnum
They don't care. You would be an assumed un-indicted felon based on their records compiled from internet purchases made either directly by you or taken from vendor records they have amassed by monitoring sites such as this one. Sure they may get a few hundred wrong, but so what, they don't care.
When they feel the time is right, they will act.
Robin
When they feel the time is right, they will act.
Robin
gun_slinger_boy
.338 Win Mag
Now you're getting it!
Getting what ? It was a serious question. No law can survive scrutiny if it can not be complied with. There is no way that I see that anyone can comply with these laws without breaking other laws. Any court challenge to them should have them declared void.
Bozo
.45 acp
Theoretically true, but first you will have to be arrested, spend thousands on lawyers, appeal to a higher court or 3 once the initial guilty verdict is rendered, etc. In the meantime, your job/business will likely evaporate and your spouse may just decide to find greener pastures. In reality, you will accept a plea deal, because financial/familial ruin does not seem all that attractive. NYS knows this, and uses their unconstitutional laws to force your hand. The gov has no interest in litigating these laws, but they know very, very few citizens have the means to mount and sustain an effective challenge.
gun_slinger_boy
.338 Win Mag
Right.
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
using someone to serial number your 80 .. you will be breaking fed law then .. lol .. no build parties .. and per fed you don't have to serial it if you build it unless u want to sell it later on down the road ..
You have to do the work to make it a firearm on your own. Engraving manufacturer and serial number does not have to be done by you.
FRANKIE
6.5 Creedmoor
If you noticed there’s a little clause in the article of the new law;
“No details on the process for serializing firearms are currently available.”
This is clearly another “Devil is in the details
Page out of the circle jerk playbook.” So taking in consideration methods and formats others have mentioned here, there really is no correct way.
This leaves the owner/builder left in the lurch.
As a safe measure and for your own protection, The best engraving on these said (in this case speaking of) rifle receivers, would be in three places;
1/4” wide, by infinite depth, times 3 with an acetylene torch.
Yes, they are getting what they want..
But not everything they want.
“No details on the process for serializing firearms are currently available.”
This is clearly another “Devil is in the details
Page out of the circle jerk playbook.” So taking in consideration methods and formats others have mentioned here, there really is no correct way.
This leaves the owner/builder left in the lurch.
As a safe measure and for your own protection, The best engraving on these said (in this case speaking of) rifle receivers, would be in three places;
1/4” wide, by infinite depth, times 3 with an acetylene torch.
Yes, they are getting what they want..
But not everything they want.
spat
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Sure, but none of them comply with the 2A either.
They DGAF.
"We ignored 25 reasons this law is invalid, but congratulations, you found #26 so we'll drop it".
At this point it is like telling Al Capones goons they have no right to trash your store when you can't pay the protection money.
You're right, they don't. You mistake was thinking they care that they don't
tc556guy
.40 S&W
So we need a breakdown of what went into effect. The news articles highlight the "ghost gun unserialized receiver part of the language, but overlook the "finished receiver" language in the legislation. Also, what's the status of a non-gunsmith doing their own build?
tc556guy
.40 S&W
Did this language make it into the final bill?2019-S2143A
Relates to the manufacture, assembly, possession, license and disposal of ghost guns, the establishment of the offense of unlawful dissemination of instructions for the assembly of a weapon and the sentencing for certain offenses regarding ghost guns; relates to the suspension and revocation of...www.nysenate.gov
Just read the proposed law and it appears to only cover un-serialized blanks specifically 80% percent lowers.
The status of that bill shows it hung up in committee, but I don't know if it got merged into another bill down the road
It sounds like the intent was to ban the manufacture of any firearm by a non-gunsmith:
"Section 5 adds a new subdivision 8 to section 265.10 of the penal law to
provide that any person other than a licensed gunsmith who assembles,
manufactures, or causes to be assembled or manufactured a firearm,
rifle, shotgun, or unfinished firearm frame or receiver is guilty of a
Class C felony.
I honestly do not know if it was just a "rule of thumb" that said a person could build their own firearm, or if the Supreme Court ruled it was part of our Rights.
Personally...
tc556guy
.40 S&W
What are you going to do when they start tracking down the people who are buying stripped lowers to see what they're building them into?
Tell them to fuck off.
And if no one wants to help then I guess my prediction will be right, and my government really will be what kills me.
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
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Fkoff NYS .. its unconstitutional ..
Bozo
.45 acp
No, not in the final bill. S13A and S14A are the bills signed into law. Those specify possession of an unfinished/unserialized receiver or "ghost gun" as a class A misdemeanor.
tc556guy
.40 S&W
I believe that the language wasn't limited to unfinished receivers and included finished receivers. I'll have to reread it in the morning again when I have more than my phone
Good info here on 13a & 14a:
ormondarms.com
2021 New Gun Laws (New York Bills S13A & S14A)
2021 has been a busy year for new gun legislation in America’s most populous states-- California, Texas, Florida, and New York.
ormondarms.com
The Collectors book he speaks of:
From that site:
S13A bans 80% lowers or other parts designed to be finished and fashioned into a firearm. This law goes into effect 120 days from October 28th 2021.
S14A requires any 80% receiver or unfinished gun part intended to be made by the end user, to be serialized within 180 days of October 28th 2021.
For complete text of the new bills, you may view them here:
After this date, you will no longer be able to have an 80% receiver shipped to New York, or purchase an unserialized lower in New York. By 60 days beyond 2/26/22, owners who purchased unserialized lowers will need to have the parts serialized to be in compliance with both laws.
S13A bans 80% lowers or other parts designed to be finished and fashioned into a firearm. This law goes into effect 120 days from October 28th 2021.
S14A requires any 80% receiver or unfinished gun part intended to be made by the end user, to be serialized within 180 days of October 28th 2021.
For complete text of the new bills, you may view them here:
- Https://Legislation.Nysenate.Gov/Pdf/Bills/2021/S13a
- Https://Legislation.Nysenate.Gov/Pdf/Bills/2021/S14A
After this date, you will no longer be able to have an 80% receiver shipped to New York, or purchase an unserialized lower in New York. By 60 days beyond 2/26/22, owners who purchased unserialized lowers will need to have the parts serialized to be in compliance with both laws.
From 14a:
8-a. "Serialized" means bearing a visible identification number and/or symbol in accordance with the requirements imposed on licensed importers and licensed manufacturers pursuant to subsection (i) of Section 923 of Title 18 of the United States Code and regulations issued pursuant thereto in effect at the time of assembly, except for antique firearms as defined in subdivision fourteen of this section, as added by chapter nine hundred eighty-six of the laws of nineteen hundred seventy-four, or any firearm, rifle or shotgun manufactured prior to nineteen hundred sixty-eight.
8-a. "Serialized" means bearing a visible identification number and/or symbol in accordance with the requirements imposed on licensed importers and licensed manufacturers pursuant to subsection (i) of Section 923 of Title 18 of the United States Code and regulations issued pursuant thereto in effect at the time of assembly, except for antique firearms as defined in subdivision fourteen of this section, as added by chapter nine hundred eighty-six of the laws of nineteen hundred seventy-four, or any firearm, rifle or shotgun manufactured prior to nineteen hundred sixty-eight.
13a on 80% receivers:
1. Possession of an unfinished frame or receiver is added to section 265 of current law and makes it an A misdemeanor to possess such.
2. Criminal sale of an unfinished frame or receiver in the second degree is a class E felony. Second degree is 1-9 units.
3. Criminal sale of an unfinished frame or receiver in the first degree is a class D felony. First degree is 10 units or more.
And giving one away is considered as a sale: A person is guilty of criminal sale of an unfinished frame or receiver in the second degree when, knowing it is an unfinished frame or receiver, such person unlawfully sells, exchanges, gives or disposes of an unfinished frame or receiver (six months after the effective date),
1. Possession of an unfinished frame or receiver is added to section 265 of current law and makes it an A misdemeanor to possess such.
2. Criminal sale of an unfinished frame or receiver in the second degree is a class E felony. Second degree is 1-9 units.
3. Criminal sale of an unfinished frame or receiver in the first degree is a class D felony. First degree is 10 units or more.
And giving one away is considered as a sale: A person is guilty of criminal sale of an unfinished frame or receiver in the second degree when, knowing it is an unfinished frame or receiver, such person unlawfully sells, exchanges, gives or disposes of an unfinished frame or receiver (six months after the effective date),
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