Just a place to talk about Kalashnikov rifles

[Podmonkey]

Havent had a chance to read all.the new posts will when I get home ...

Butttt @Podmonkey

Havent had a chance to read all.the new posts will when I get home ...

Butttt @Podmonkey

Or

Which?

 

[Edwardteach72]

View attachment 46912

Or
View attachment 46913
Which?

Galil 1,000%

 

[Podmonkey]

Galil 1,000%

Throw out any preconceived notions regarding relative quality. Say they were made by the same company to the exact same quality level.
9.5" 9mm or 9.5" 5.56?

 

[Edwardteach72]

I'm not wondering if the NYLAK stock will fit on a galil ace in 5.56 cause that would be an acceptable set up

 

[Edwardteach72]

Throw out any preconceived notions regarding relative quality. Say they were made by the same company to the exact same quality level.
9.5" 9mm or 9.5" 5.56?

Honestly a week ago I would have maybe learned 9mm But I have been browsing the YT and starting to see a notion that while effective PCCthings are more of a fun gun than anything

 

[Podmonkey]

I'm not wondering if the NYLAK stock will fit on a galil ace in 5.56 cause that would be an acceptable set up

Say both guns could be setup in any config you wanted.

 

[Edwardteach72]

But 9.5in for 5.56 is also kinda cutting that round down to novelty numbers as well

 

[Podmonkey]

Honestly a week ago I would have maybe learned 9mm But I have been browsing the YT and starting to see a notion that while effective PCCthings are more of a fun gun than anything

Does 5.56 still have anything useful to give out of such a short barrel?

 

[Edwardteach72]

Does 5.56 still have anything useful to give out of such a short barrel?

My limited knowledge leans that 11.5 or maybe even 10.5 is about the stop point for usefulness

 

[Podmonkey]

My limited knowledge leans that 11.5 or maybe even 10.5 is about the stop point for usefulness

That's for reliability out of an AR.
Doesn't apply to the Galil with it's long stroke has piston. Those 5.56 pistols run.

 

[Edwardteach72]

And at that point a 9.5 9mm is going to be launching a 115g or 124 pretty fast

 

[Edwardteach72]

That's for reliability out of an AR.
Doesn't apply to the Galil with it's long stroke has piston. Those 5.56 pistols run.

I'm thinking velocity

 

[Podmonkey]

So 9mm PCC?

 

[Edwardteach72]

So 9mm PCC?

Yea I'm thinking at that barrel length it should be a better option

 

[Podmonkey]

Yea I'm thinking at that barrel length it should be a better option

Say you found yourself trapped in the middle of a massive demonstration turned riot and you had to shoot your way out, which type of gun would you rather have?

 

[Edwardteach72]

Say you found yourself trapped in the middle of a massive demonstration turned riot and you had to shoot your way out, which type of gun would you rather have?

That's a tough one... I'm thinking 5.56 with a good LPVO

 

[Podmonkey]

That's a tough one... I'm thinking 5.56 with a good LPVO

You are restricted to th 9.5" barrel length.
You want something that can be stored in a bag so inconspicuous the sight of it even out in the open would draw no attention whatsoever. Because no long gun could ever be possibly stored in such a small bag.

 

[Edwardteach72]

You are restricted to th 9.5" barrel length.
You want something that can be stored in a bag so inconspicuous the sight of it even out in the open would draw no attention whatsoever. Because no long gun could ever be possibly stored in such a small bag.

God damn this is a tough one tbh

 

[Edwardteach72]

Yea looks like 9.5 is about the max barrel length I'm going to think my answer will be 9mm with side folding brace

 

[BDinPutnam]

You are restricted to th 9.5" barrel length.
You want something that can be stored in a bag so inconspicuous the sight of it even out in the open would draw no attention whatsoever. Because no long gun could ever be possibly stored in such a small bag.

5.56

Weight/size ammo ratio.

ETA: do I care about collateral damage in this scenario? I'm thinking no?

 

[Edwardteach72]

9x39 allowed?

 

[Podmonkey]

9x39 allowed?

No

 

[Podmonkey]

God damn this is a tough one tbh

I agree

 

[Podmonkey]

5.56

Weight/size ammo ratio.

ETA: do I care about collateral damage in this scenario? I'm thinking no?

Collateral damage is irrelevant

 

[Edwardteach72]

No

Damn you pod

 

[Edwardteach72]

Damn I picked a good night to take a half night. One min and I may have my answer

 

[BDinPutnam]

Collateral damage is irrelevant

Provided we are talking only 9mm vs 5.56 at this point I will take the 5.56 in the scenario you described.

Edit: though at those ranges out of that same barrel a heavier bullet might be an advantage.

 

[Podmonkey]

Provided we are talking only 9mm vs 5.56 at this point I will take the 5.56 in the scenario you described.

Edit: though at those ranges out of that same barrel a heavier bullet might be an advantage.

I have researched this extensively. Muzzle velocity of 5.56 out of a 9.5" barrel gives energy values roughly similar to 10mm auto out of a 6" barrel.
10mm is not an option due to a lack of 30 round or greater magazines. Volume of fire is critical here. Other calibers are on the table but 9mm and 5.56 is what is "standardized".

 

[Edwardteach72]

Ok looking at some charts I'm seeing this (they had other ammo data but I'm going to work with just 4 for the 9mm, one light for caliber, 2 more standard weights, and then one heavy for calibee)

9" barrel

Cor Bon 90 grain JHP +p
1,663fps = 553ft lbs

Federal 115 grain JHP
1,238fps = 391ft lbs

Speer Gold Dots Short barrel 124 grain
1,345fps = 498ft lbs

Federal Hydra-shok JHP 147 grain
1,055fps = 363ft lbs

source -> BBTI - Ballistics by the Inch :: 9mm Luger Results

Now going to look at 5.56 from a 9" barrel
(These 4 loads seem to be pretty standard weight with one as a heavy 68 grain)

Remington UMC 223rem 55 grain FMJ
2,403fps = 705ft lbs

Federal XM193 55 grain FMJ
2,662fps = 865ft lbs

Winchester M855 62 grain FMJ
2,403fps = 795ft lbs

Black Hills 223 68 grain "Heavy Match"
There was only 8" and 10" data so I figured the difference, divided in half and added that to the fps of the 8" (sadly that is not the best but its something)
2,217fps = 720ft lbs

source ->
https://rifleshooter.com/2015/12/22...el-length-and-velocity-26-inches-to-6-inches/

And I did the energy conversion using this calculator
Bullet Energy Calculator | Ballistics101.com


I think I may be leaning 5.56 isnt as much of a slouch from a 9" as I was thinking

 

[Podmonkey]

Ok looking at some charts I'm seeing this (they had other ammo data but I'm going to work with just 4 for the 9mm, one light for caliber, 2 more standard weights, and then one heavy for calibee)

9" barrel

Cor Bon 90 grain JHP +p
1,663fps = 553ft lbs

Federal 115 grain JHP
1,238fps = 391ft lbs

Speer Gold Dots Short barrel 124 grain
1,345fps = 498ft lbs

Federal Hydra-shok JHP 147 grain
1,055fps = 363ft lbs

source -> BBTI - Ballistics by the Inch :: 9mm Luger Results

Now going to look at 5.56 from a 9" barrel
(These 4 loads seem to be pretty standard weight with one as a heavy 68 grain)

Remington UMC 223rem 55 grain FMJ
2,403fps = 705ft lbs

Federal XM193 55 grain FMJ
2,662fps = 865ft lbs

Winchester M855 62 grain FMJ
2,403fps = 795ft lbs

Black Hills 223 68 grain "Heavy Match"
There was only 8" and 10" data so I figured the difference, divided in half and added that to the fps of the 8" (sadly that is not the best but its something)
2,217fps = 720ft lbs

source ->
https://rifleshooter.com/2015/12/22...el-length-and-velocity-26-inches-to-6-inches/

And I did the energy conversion using this calculator
Bullet Energy Calculator | Ballistics101.com


I think I may be leaning 5.56 isnt as much of a slouch from a 9" as I was thinking

The Galil Ace gives the strong impression of being a weapon that can be counted on in the direst of straits.