NYPD confiscation

[subsonic]

"The state does claim that city folks could get a permit in another county and buy and keep pistols on another county’s permit in that county, but that might not be possible for most folks who don’t have a bond fide second residence."

If this is true, then how come people in counties who put restrictions on permits can't get an unrestricted permit in a friendlier county?

You normally need to either have a secondary dwelling of some sort or at least own property. Plus you generally have to get sponsors who have known you long enough and also live in that county. That's a pretty big barrier to getting a permit.

I should add the state didn't make that claim for Joe Schmoe that wants to go shooting upstate, they made that in response to the plaintiffs who did already have summer homes and wanted to take their pistols on their NYC permit there.

 

[Airborneguy]

I'm not trying to derail this post but keeping your long gun outside city limits with your friend is now a class A misdeameanor if you don't conduct a background check (thanks FUAC).
Only exceptions are parent/stepparent/child and spouse combinations.

I have a few DV cases where the "perp" has/had a permit and their explanation was the gun as been moved out of the city. It ends there as whether or not I was interested in looking further, legally there is not much we could do. We're not getting a search warrant for an administrative code.

I'm stating this from a legal standpoint, not my personal opinion of how things should be handled. I say this because there's people who will jump on this statement to "prove" I am an "oathbreaker".

In other words, in a "check the box" sense, once the person moves a long gun out of NYC, all NYS laws apply. That gun is no longer subject to NYC's "extra" rules (not laws, they're administrative codes). Yes this is legal and no the cops can't force the person to "prove" where it went. The license division can only cancel whatever valid license the person may have if they can't produce or refuse to produce the firearm. There's no criminal penalty whatsoever.

 

[Truebeliever]

In other words, you concede that she didn’t need to volunteer it, she was asked. She may well have had no intention of throwing her husband under the bus. She might not have known about the permit issue.

When a cop with guns is at your house asking you a question, your choices are answer honestly, lie (which is potentially a crime itself, and at the very least can be held against you to prove consciousness of guilt and dishonesty), or refuse to cooperate. And how do you think the police would react if she said “I don’t want to answer that question?” Or better yet, said “I invoke my right under the fifth amendment to remain silent.” Or, “I don’t want to answer that question without my attorney present.” It’s not impossible, but in my experience I find it highly unbelievable that they would have said “alright ma’am, we’ll skip that one.” and carried on. Most people will naturally be pressured to comply with cops in that situation and most cops will use all their tools at hand to gain compliance.

I don’t concede anything of the sort.

I am mentioning that it was definitely not an expired license that lead to the gun.

I can flat out tell you from ACTUAL experience that people refuse to answer questions especially those questions all the time. It’s on a form mandated by the state that they sign or refuse to sign ( they do that all the time too)

It is a form with checkbox questions that is required to be filled out on every single domestic incident. Out of the hundreds of thousands of these reports how many people just simply refuse questions or lie at some point in the process. Guess what, it’s a lot of them. That’s one reason the complainant is asked to sign it and write the story in their own words ( which often doesn’t match what they verbally told the police at the scene.


You seem to underestimate the anger of a woman in an argument. They can be the most loyal or the fastest ones to rat out their man. Flat out call to report such things when they are angry. A lot of women do not have the same stigma of being a “rat” and have no problems calling in real or fake complaints. I would see it everyday at work, a few times a day.

Some women would claim he hit her, I would explain she didn’t have an injury so no crime and get even angrier then say “ what about this” and tell a crime he was committing.

Don’t believe me, go watch two or three episodes of cops or Live PD. That’s how common it is.

 

[Phauxtoe]

The argument started in the bedroom with a dispute over whose turn it is to be on top. NYPD resolution team settled the dispute by convincing the couple to spoon.

I disagree!
I see it as the guy getting in the BUTT!
(They stole his rifle!)

 

[Defilade]

 

[GOPerfect]

It is kind of funny how so many here have read the reports of this incident.

Wonder how many members here have spoken with the two that were involved in this DV.

 

[nortatoga]

It is kind of funny how so many here have read the reports of this incident.

Wonder how many members here have spoken with the two that were involved in this DV.

 

[Marine Cpl]

It's kind of funny how the 2nd Amendment doesn't read, "Necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed except in cases where one yells at another in their domicile."

 

[GOPerfect]

It's kind of funny how the 2nd Amendment doesn't read, "Necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed except in cases where one yells at another in their domicile."

Is that what occurred during this call? Did you get a chance to read the reports? The individual statements?

I have learned through time with my current job, not to jump to too many conclusions in these type incidents until ALL facts are known.

But, that's just me.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Is that what occurred during this call? Did you get a chance to read the reports? The individual statements?

I have learned through time with my current job, not to jump to too many conclusions in these type incidents until ALL facts are known.

But, that's just me.

Ok. Enlighten me then. My statement still stands.

The 2A doesn't say, " Necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed except in cases where .............."

Why didn't they confiscate his kitchen knives, tools, and gasoline then if he was such a danger? If he was such a danger to his wife, he should have been locked up if a crime was committed or placed in a padded room if he was a mental deficient.

 

[@thewheels]

Ok. Enlighten me then. My statement still stands.

The 2A doesn't say, " Necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed except in cases where .............."

Why didn't they confiscate his kitchen knives, tools, and gasoline then if he was such a danger? If he was such a danger to his wife, he should have been locked up if a crime was committed or placed in a padded room if he was a mental deficient.

You're just being pragmatic.

 

[Marine Cpl]

You're just being pragmatic.

No. I'm being a Constitutionalist. I am not for the giving up of rights for the greater good. If the Constitution says "X" then it's "X" and not sometimes "Y".

When you start giving up your rights for the greater good, they get taken away as evidenced now and once it happens often, it becomes normal to the point where people like you see these infringements as okay and normal when they are not.

 

[@thewheels]

I am not for the giving up of rights for the greater good. If the Constitution says "X" then it's "X" and not sometimes "Y".

Agreed

 

[GOPerfect]

No. I'm being a Constitutionalist. I am not for the giving up of rights for the greater good. If the Constitution says "X" then it's "X" and not sometimes "Y".

When you start giving up your rights for the greater good, they get taken away as evidenced now and once it happens often, it becomes normal to the point where people like you see these infringements as okay and normal when they are not.

I agree. However..... Maybe, just maybe, in this situation, a rights violation did not occur. Possible?

 

[Marine Cpl]

I agree. However..... Maybe, just maybe, in this situation, a rights violation did not occur. Possible?

The way I see it, they confiscated an arm from a citizen that had a right to have one and left him free so I would say no. If they instead passed laws that domestic abusers had to be locked up pending trial, that would be constitutional as long as he got a speedy trial of his peers, his bail wasn't excessive, and all that jazz.

 

[GOPerfect]

The way I see it, they confiscated an arm from a citizen that had a right to have one and left him free, I would say no. If they instead passed laws that domestic abusers had to be locked up pending trial, that would be constitutional as long as he got a speedy trial of his peers, his bail wasn't excessive, and all that jazz.

Im picking up what you are putting down.

I just think there is more to this story than a gun grab.

 

[subsonic]

Im picking up what you are putting down.

I just think there is more to this story than a gun grab.

The precinct is literally tweeting it out as a gun grab with #OneLessGun (really sounds like they’re just going to give it back, doesn’t it?).

Isn’t it great that they got “ratio’d” for what it is as the kids say on Twitter, while here at nygunforum we have half the community either backing up the cops or saying they’re at fault anyway so who cares.

I can simultaneously say that this is the fault of VOTERS and POLITICIANS and that the cops were not “bad people” for “doing their jobs” while also recognizing that the second amendment exists to protect people who aren’t perfect and who may have arguments with their spouses or touchy neighbors or who aren’t the most loveable people in the world. And that “more to the story” doesn’t justify a rifle-registration-backed gun grab. The police report isn’t public, it’s one sided and doesn’t tell the whole story anyway, so I’m not going to go turn around and invade this couples privacy by FOILing it to make a point.

Regardless of the specific facts of this case, it remains the fact that registration leads to confiscation, as here, and the authorities do use pressure to pit families against one another and go after the weakest link the bypass constitutional rights. That includes things like DV responses, mandatory arrests, gun inquiries and confiscations where no crime is committed in a squabble they may or may not have been escalated by one partner or their neighbor.

 

[GOPerfect]

I agree that registration leads to consfication. I do not stand up for bad cops or bad laws. I cross over this little line quite often.

I refuse to register my guns. Never have and never will, except the pistols on my permit. Any gun owner that registers is a fool.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Unless it's pistols.

 

[GOPerfect]

Unless it's pistols.

Yeah, I put that in my statement. If it was not for the stupid permit laws, my handguns would not be registered either

 

[Airborneguy]

I sent this thread to the supervisor over there today. He was laughing his ass off.

There’s one part of the initial report which I showed to @GOPerfect which fully justifies this whole thing but at the risk of having to block more people for calling me a liar, I’m going to leave it at that.

 

[GOPerfect]

I sent this thread to the supervisor over there today. He was laughing his ass off.

There’s one part of the initial report which I showed to @GOPerfect which fully justifies this whole thing but at the risk of having to block more people for calling me a liar, I’m going to leave it at that.

I was gonna leave them all to the ignorant comments. I kept saying there is more to this story than just infringement of rights.

No one cares about facts, kind of like AOC. She does not like true facts either.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I sent this thread to the supervisor over there today. He was laughing his ass off.

There’s one part of the initial report which I showed to @GOPerfect which fully justifies this whole thing but at the risk of having to block more people for calling me a liar, I’m going to leave it at that.

So did he get locked up? If not, it's a 2nd Amendment violation no matter what you refuse to say are the facts of the case.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Yeah, I put that in my statement. If it was not for the stupid permit laws, my handguns would not be registered either

I get it. I do it too so as to protect myself and family since they got me by the balls. I would see it the same if one did so for an AR rifle. That was my point in the other thread.

In either case one can stash rifles and pistols that they don't know about. And there are ways to get pistols they don't know about as well. Just saying.

 

[Airborneguy]

So did he get locked up? If not, it's a 2nd Amendment violation no matter what you refuse to say are the facts of the case.

There’s another option that you may consider a violation of rights but 99% of others would agree is not: mental health issues.

 

[Marine Cpl]

There’s another option that you may consider a violation of rights but 99% of others would agree is not: mental health issues.

I'm of the faction that believes if someone is a mental deficient that would harm himself or others, he or she shouldn't be let to roam free amongst society because he or she can harm himself or herself or others with other instruments.

 

[GOPerfect]

I get it. I do it too so as to protect myself and family since they got me by the balls. I would see it the same if one did so for an AR rifle. That was my point in the other thread.

In either case one can stash rifles and pistols that they don't know about. And there are ways to get pistols they don't know about as well. Just saying.

For the most part, I know you get "it". Sometimes you're just a dick to be a dick. I'm okay with that.

There are times the entire story/narrative is not put out for all to see. I have learned to slow my role a bit and try to see and understand all of the facts

 

[Marine Cpl]

For the most part, I know you get "it". Sometimes you're just a dick to be a dick. I'm okay with that.

There are times the entire story/narrative is not put out for all to see. I have learned to slow my role a bit and try to see and understand all of the facts

Not trying to be a dick. Just trying to point out that if one values their defense to register for a pistol since it's his only option, one can register his AR rifle because for the same reason.

For me, the AR rifle is what I feel comfortable with compared to any other rifle bar none.

 

[Mosinitis]

I don't know what to think when a guy who likes to dress up as the character from Star Wars raises the issue of mental illness.

 

[Airborneguy]

I'm of the faction that believes if someone is a mental deficient that would harm himself or others, he or she shouldn't be let to roam free amongst society because he or she can harm himself or herself or others with other instruments.

Well I tend to agree but just because society no longer has the stomach institutionalization any longer doesn’t mean they cannot be touched at all.