Sighted in Savage Axis 308 yesterday, few issues

[Cleck]

I'll let the pictures do the talking, then I'll explain.

Went to the range, 25 yards, using the supplied 3-9x40 scope. Didn't quite have the settings I wanted. I don't shoot much, so I wanted a table or steady surface and a sandbag to keep the stock steady. I wanted to eliminate anything on my part for the sight in. Long story short, I didn't have it. The bench/table I was using was looser than wet shit and shook all over the place. No place to rest the rear stock, so I was all over the place. Up adjusted well enough, just couldn't pull it left enough.

Take a look at this video of me shooting my friend's 458 AR, and you can see what I mean. Gun goes to the right mostly.


What I didn't try was aiming left and seeing if it went to the bulls. It's consistently....right of target, so is that all on me, the table, or a combination of both?

Rounds used if you can't read the sheet were Hornady Whitetail 150 grain soft tips.

 

[Jaywmustang]

Did u adjust the scope to move poi left?

 

[MilesTeg]

If you look at my hunting rifle thread, my 308 didn't care for any of the 150gr factory ammo. I tried that same Hornady stuff along with the comparable Winchester stuff. I'm now going to try to reload some different stuff for it and see if that helps. That would be my suggestion to you also, is to try some different weight projectiles. Keep us updated on what you end up doing.

 

[Cleck]

@Jaywmustang Do you mean did I physically move the scope left or did I adjust the crosshairs? I definitely adjusted the reticle, as it was definitely shooting more right at the beginning. I did not aim to the left.

@MilesTeg I'll try that. I figure each time I go, I'll try a different box of ammo. Keeping track of all of these sessions in a folder that I keep w/ the rifle. Do you mean to say it didn't like ANY 150gr loads, or just this particular offering from Hornady?

 

[MilesTeg]

@Jaywmustang Do you mean did I physically move the scope left or did I adjust the crosshairs? I definitely adjusted the reticle, as it was definitely shooting more right at the beginning. I did not aim to the left.

@MilesTeg I'll try that. I figure each time I go, I'll try a different box of ammo. Keeping track of all of these sessions in a folder that I keep w/ the rifle. Do you mean to say it didn't like ANY 150gr loads, or just this particular offering from Hornady?

I tried Hornady and Winchester 150gr soft points. In 5 shot groups I had a hard time keeping them under 3" at 100 yds. I don't think this was all the ammo's fault but I do think it was a part if it. I couldn't find anything else locally to try out. The only other ammo I found was 180gr and I had no urge to use that on whitetails. I don't know if you reload or know someone that will let you use their setup to make ammo, but I'm going to try out 130gr Barnes TTSX's. If those don't work I do have some 168gr Sierra Gamekings to try out.

 

[RandallOfLegend]

I got a chuckle at the video. I am sorry. But I have never seen anyone use the TV trays for holding pistols/ammo/magazines used as a rifle bench. Looking at the range, I am surprised they allow rifles at all.

- Might want to price some cheap 150 grain ammo to to a prelimary sight in. At 25 yards it won't make a difference. Sucks spending $1 a shot for hunting ammo to dial in a scope.
- The cheap bench shouldn't really affect your accuracy if it's stable when you pull the trigger. The bullet should be out of the barrel before it goes cattywumpus.
- What magnification were you using?
- Is the scope mounted level? I assume when you adjusted windage you didn't get elevation changes.

 

[dsdmmat]

Did you take your time shooting the ammo or did you heat up your barrel? A hot barrel can result in wandering bullets.

 

[nortatoga]

In the video you seem to be pulling to the right, could the percussion off the wall be affecting you? And I'm not really sure but it looked like you may not be holding your trigger back ( follow thru ) What we call happy finger at Appleseed Shoots.

 

[Jaywmustang]

@Jaywmustang Do you mean did I physically move the scope left or did I adjust the crosshairs? I definitely adjusted the reticle, as it was definitely shooting more right at the beginning. I did not aim to the left.

@MilesTeg I'll try that. I figure each time I go, I'll try a different box of ammo. Keeping track of all of these sessions in a folder that I keep w/ the rifle. Do you mean to say it didn't like ANY 150gr loads, or just this particular offering from Hornady?

Yes, the horizontal/windage adjustment. Is the adjustment maxed out to the left? At 25 yards, you should be able to get close to the bullseye with any ammo. How do you sight your rifle in? The video isn't coming up for me

 

[Cleck]

-Yeah, like I said, it wasn't ideal shooting conditions (for me). I needed to be steadyish, and I couldn't lay on the floor.
-I used 3x magnification. I was under the impression that is how I should be sighting it in. Not the case? I had a friend with me and he's done it a few times to his rifles, so I figured I'd just listen to him, but zero on 3x because using 9 would -have thrown things off.
-The scope came mounted, so I didn't touch it. I had him look at it and he thought everything was as it should be. It initially started shooting low, so I got that adjusted fine, I was happy w/ it.
-There was plenty of time between shots. Barrel got warm, but it wasn't ridiculous. I probably took a few minutes between shots.

@nortatoga Good question, not really sure here. Maybe I'll go back and try shooting from the right side. It's possible that I wasn't completely holding the trigger once it shot. I didn't feel like I was jerking it either, probably a soft squeeze, but not completely holding it after it was done.
@Jaywmustang I definitely adjusted windage and elevation. I saw the holes start to move, they definitely moved up and to the left as I started, but then stagnated. I tried adjusting more left windage, but after a few more hits, I wasn't sure if it was the table/me or if it just needed more adjustments. That's where I'm fuzzy. I had him shoot 1 or 2 as well to see if it was me, as he has been shooting longer, but his results were identical to mine. Not quite sure if I can tell if it's max adjusted, but I would assume if it was, it wouldn't click anymore?

How do you mean, how do I sight in the rifle? I took it for granted that it said it was factory bore sighted, so I didn't look down the chamber/barrel like I've read. In order to do that, does that mean I need to pull the bolt too?

I shot a round, looked close, assumed it was 1/4 inch per click, adjusted a few clicks, shot again, rinse and repeat. Once I started to hit the same spot, I didn't think I was gonna get more productive. I'd really like to lay on the ground with a sandbag so I can take the butt moving out of the equation. I'm not a still person. I know it's not a good excuse, it just means I need to shoot more, but I need to eliminate me from the equation.

 

[Cleck]

The video was mostly for reference, just to illustrate the shooting conditions. It's not an actual video of my rifle.

 

[nortatoga]

It is 1/4" at 100 yards. So at 25 yards it is 16 clicks per inch.

 

[Cleck]

That might be part of the issue, bahahahaha. Could be that the elevation wasn't that far off and a few clicks brought it in, where the windage was waaaaaaay off and I didn't think about that, lol.

Damn, now I gotta try it again.

Also, this is just an exercise, as I'll be getting a new scope soon, so I'll have to do this all over again.

 

[Cleck]

My other question is relating to laser bore sights. If I'm gonna do this again, would it make sense to buy one to finish this (and see how far off I am), then make setting up the next one even easier?

 

[dsdmmat]

My other question is relating to laser bore sights. If I'm gonna do this again, would it make sense to buy one to finish this (and see how far off I am), then make setting up the next one even easier?

Laser bore sights only make sense if you have somewhere that you can get 25-30 yards worth of distance, beyond that the dot gets huge. I have 30 feet inside my house which I use to initially set the scope. Then I have a tree out my back door that is at 30 yards that I verify the settings with before going to the range. It is still off at 100 but, at least it is on paper.

 

[Cleck]

Right, I can probably say the same thing in my house, but the range also is 25 yards, that's a lot better than spending this many shots trying to get near the circle, rather than getting it close right off the bat, then spending a few rounds fine tuning it at 100. Right?

 

[dsdmmat]

Right, I can probably say the same thing in my house, but the range also is 25 yards, that's a lot better than spending this many shots trying to get near the circle, rather than getting it close right off the bat, then spending a few rounds fine tuning it at 100. Right?

if you are going to do this at your range (which looks well lit) get some of the laser reflective targets from Birchwood Casey.
Birchwood Casey Shoot-N-C 8" Laser Target (6 pack) | Airgun Depot

 

[nortatoga]

Graph paper also is great for sighting in a firearm, and this time of year I always pick up some marked down wrapping paper (some call it witness paper ) the last rolls I got had 1 in grids on the back, put a aim point in the center or put another target in the center. This works good if the backstop is shot up.

 

[Cleck]

Yeah, I think I'm gonna use the same target next time, but mark it with a ruler before I go, that should work

 

[MilesTeg]

I don't have a bore sight tool.

I usually put the target out 25yds or closer depending on the situation. Then pull the bolt and look down the barrel and center it on the target. Next center the cross hairs on the target. This is usually good enough to get me on paper at 25yds.

Next is the critical part if you want to save ammo on zero'ing the rifle. You need to know the distance to your target and what your scope adjusts in. Like stated above at 25yds with a scope that does 1/4" click at 100yds you need 16 clicks to move an inch. From there it's easy shoot once, if your confident that was a good shot measure the POI hole to the bullseye. Then do the math for how many clicks and you should be close. Once your dialed in close check impacts out to the desired zero range to make sure your not wondering too far. Then once at the desired yardage re zero the rifle.

 

[nortatoga]

Putting your own grid over that will work too! It just helps figuring the clicks.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

never mind

 

[Jaywmustang]

When I sight in, I will generally shoot 3 shots after each adjustment. If the first and second rounds are touching I don't bother with the 3rd. I also use targets with 5 bullseye so I can see what the adjustment are doing and I don't confuse my current shots with my past shots. It is hard to tell what your rifle is doing with the photos above.

I don't own a laser bore sight tool but I have had some of my optic installed with one at a store. I wasn't impressed..... maybe it wasn't done right idk. I think I had one on paper out of 4, the other were not on paper at 100 yards. I find it easier just to mount my optics and shoot it at 100 yards. If it is not on paper, I move back to 50 yards with a big piece of cardboard or paper, still not on, repeat at 25 yards. I think I have only had to do this with one rifle, this rifle also had the optic installed from the factory. It was waaaayyyy off lol. I was surprised.

 

[RandallOfLegend]

I use a laser bore sight often. Arbor type. I need to recalibrate ot though. My standard procedure is to check laser point of aim by rotating the laser in 90 degree increments. It helps me get within about 6 inches at 25 yards.

 

[Cleck]

Went back yesterday with my new cartridge style laser sight, and the results were better. I'm still working out learning the scope adjustment kinks, so I just wanted to make sure I was closer on paper this time, and that I could consistently shoot better groups. Used a small table at the range and they had a mount, so it was better than last time, at least I wasn't really wobbling all over the place, but the table was as sturdy as a newborn fawn's legs. Again, I'll let the pics speak for themselves.

I took additional measurements, but I'm not sure if they matter, because it occurred to me that I just numbered the holes, but not in the order that I shot them in. If the order doesn't matter, then I'll post em, but they all ranged from 1/2" - 1-1/10"

After looking at this, I slowly realized that yeah, I was shooting high at 25 yards, but I wanna see where that ends up at 100. Still, I was aimed at bulls, so I need to adjust the scope down a little bit, as it's still shooting high. I should have tried that, but I wanted to make sure I could at least be consistent at this point. Next time I go, I'll try adjusting down a bit.

 

[RandallOfLegend]

Elevation looks good to me. You need to stretch it out to 100 to see where it lands. You should be able nail windage at 25 yards though.

 

[Cleck]

When you say nail windage, you mean I should have had tighter groups? Or do you just mean that since the windage won't change much at 100, I should have no problem adjusting for that?

Any idea how much this might drop at 100, or is it really round dependent?

 

[squib]

It looks like your windage setting is ok, group covers target L-R pretty evenly. Make sure you let that barrel cool between shots, it's pencil thin.

 

[RandallOfLegend]

When you say nail windage, you mean I should have had tighter groups? Or do you just mean that since the windage won't change much at 100, I should have no problem adjusting for that?

Any idea how much this might drop at 100, or is it really round dependent?

Maybe I misunderstood where your shots were landing. At 25 yards, I would expect an inch grouping center to center with little effort with your rig in the photo. Ideally you should be able to chew out the vertical line on that target. Also. Always measure center to center as opposed to the edge of the hole.

Glad things are looking better!

 

[Cleck]

It looks like your windage setting is ok, group covers target L-R pretty evenly. Make sure you let that barrel cool between shots, it's pencil thin.

I didn't let it cool completely, since I was being timed/paying for time there. If I was a member, I would take more time. I let it cool slightly, taking 2-3 minutes between shots.