Urban, suburban or rural

[Podmonkey]

If I was hungry, I'd follow you home from a distance because I'd know you'll have ammo and food. I'd take my time and count who's in your home. Once you step out to piss on your lawn at 8pm, you'd be shot from a distance.



That's being grey sir.

How do you know that in a permanent WROL situation I wouldn't just shoot anyone in my vicinity for my own amusement?

 

[Marine Cpl]

How do you know that in a permanent WROL situation I wouldn't just shoot anyone in my vicinity for my own amusement?

You'd be dead in the first 48 by someone else after behaving like that.

 

[Podmonkey]

You'd be dead in the first 48 by someone else after behaving like that.

Maybe I'd be discreet about it?

 

[Marine Cpl]

Maybe I'd be discreet about it?

All jokes aside, put yourself in the criminal mind. Who would you go after? The multicam dude making a show or the guy wearing the dirty clothes at the Town Square begging people for a bite to eat?

Time, patience, and recon can crack any dude that is alone and thinks he's prepared with the latest AR500 plate carrier.

 

[Podmonkey]

My point, @Willjr75, is that in such a situation if you wanted to stalk me you had better make sure I don't see you. Not you specifically of course, in general. All I'll say is I'd have no qualms. Whatsoever.

 

[Podmonkey]

All jokes aside, put yourself in the criminal mind. Who would you go after? The multicam dude making a show or the guy wearing the dirty clothes at the Town Square begging people for a bite to eat?

Time, patience, and recon can crack any dude that is alone and thinks he's prepared with the latest AR500 plate carrier.

I'm going to go for whomever presents the lowest possible potential of injury to myself. Which pretty much excludes the multicam guy if there is any other prey around. Why waste my time and resources setting up an ambush if I can find some pushover to roll with nothing more than harsh language and posturing?

Human predators are no different than animal predators in the wild. What do wovles, lions ect. look for when hunting? The old, the young, the infirm. Anyone that presents the lowest risk of a significant struggle.

 

[Marine Cpl]

My point, @Willjr75, is that in such a situation if you wanted to stalk me you had better make sure I don't see you. Not you specifically of course, in general. All I'll say is I'd have no qualms. Whatsoever.

I know. It goes both ways. But you have to hunt big or don't hunt at all. My guess is a criminal would hunt big if he's hungry enough.

Now if I saw you and 6 others and I followed you home and I saw you guys had your shit together with watches and all that, I'd take pause and reevaluate. But if you were by yourself with just your family, I'd see you as a victim just like Lovell said.

My point is that no matter how much one thinks he's bad and shit hot, time and patience will always beat him. Sure you could shoot every man you see, but that would only last so long.

 

[FrankenCub]

I still don't even like the grey man idea, given a long enough SHTF even Mr Grey will become a target once the rest of the weak are weeded out. Survival of the fittest will play out in the cities pretty quick. I just seriously hate cities. Unless you hide by day and sneak about by night I think it will be sketchy in any populated area.
I really don't have a problem with everyone and their brother from the city running to the woods, when in reality they wont know the first thing to do once they get there. Hell, many people in rural areas don't know anything about the woods and would probably get lost once they got 300yds into them. These are completely different times from even 50 years ago. I don't see them surviving trying something so stupid. Those who are still passionate about being out with nature will be so much better off.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I'm going to go for whomever presents the lowest possible potential of injury to myself. Which pretty much excludes the multicam guy if there is any other prey around. Why waste my time and resources setting up an ambush if I can find some pushover to roll with nothing more than harsh language and posturing?

Human predators are no different than animal predators in the wild. What do wovles, lions ect. look for when hunting? The old, the young, the infirm. Anyone that presents the lowest risk of a significant struggle.

What are you looking to do with them? Eat their flesh? I would have no use for the weak and unprepared who have nothing.

That's the thinking of a petty criminal in today's society. I guess I see things different.

 

[Podmonkey]

I know. It goes both ways. But you have to hunt big or don't hunt at all. My guess is a criminal would hunt big if he's hungry enough.

Now if I saw you and 6 others and I followed you home and I saw you guys had your shit together with watches and all that, I'd take pause and reevaluate. But if you were by yourself with just your family, I'd see you as a victim just like Lovell said.

My point is that no matter how much one thinks he's bad and shit hot, time and patience will always beat him. Sure you could shoot every man you see, but that would only last so long.

That's my point, its dumb to "hunt big" once when you can "hunt small" periodically. That's how its done in the wild. One would do well to emulate the behavior of predators in nature.

Me, I'm more of an African Elephant, a Rhinoceros, a Hippopotamus or a Cape Buffalo.
I won't go out of my way to cause anyone trouble but I will have my shits and giggles when trouble finds me. Or I'll just die. So what? We are all going to die, no matter what. I'm more interested in having some shits and giggles first.

 

[Podmonkey]

What are you looking to do with them? Eat their flesh? I would have no use for the weak and unprepared who have nothing.

That's the thinking of a petty criminal in today's society. I guess I see things different.

Man's gotta eat, fuck it.

 

[Marine Cpl]

That's my point, its dumb to "hunt big" once when you can "hunt small" periodically. That's how its done in the wild. One would do well to emulate the behavior of predators in nature.

Me, I'm more of an African Elephant, a Rhinoceros, a Hippopotamus or a Cape Buffalo.
I won't go out of my way to cause anyone trouble but I will have my shits and giggles when trouble finds me. Or I'll just die. So what? We are all going to die, no matter what. I'm more interested in having some shits and giggles first.

But when things get real bad the small will have nothing in just a few weeks. Why go after them? What can they possibly give you? They would be living off ketchup and mustard if they still have that and perhaps some insects.

 

[Uzi]

I heard humans don't taste that bad. Sort of like pork I guess. Who could resist a tender calf muscle anyways? Jerky anyone?

 

[FrankenCub]

lol...I wouldn't have any problem eating most anything if needed, but I think shit would have to be really really bad before I went that far
However, having some cleaned human skeletons hanging from stakes for intruders to see might not be so bad

 

[Podmonkey]

There is value in cultivating an aura of fear and dread also.

 

[FrankenCub]

Just imagine the campfire talk away from eavesdropping eyes

 

[Criticalt]

Not if you are bunkered down in the sticks twiddling your thumbs and getting soft off your reserves while the urban loonies are hardening themselves in gang warfare.

Of course, but im talking about myself here, im not going soft after SHTF.
Im very gar from any city and surrounded by Amish.
They pretty much live like shit has already hit the fan and will be thought of as easy targets.
I know alot of Amish and some are prepared for SHTF but many would be out of luck if armed looters came for their stuff, but not all.
My closest neighbor is Amish, they have an 18 year old son, a 16 year old son and a 10 year old son. All are crack shots, know the area, are good hunters and are on my side.
They live 1/2 miles away but our property's are conected.
The father has taught them well about the possibility of the non Amish coming for them or their stuff.
If nothing else, they make great lookouts and shooters.
They are also used to being self sufficient and have taught me alot about food preparation and storage.
Anyways, SHTF will make me and mine more on point and determined.
Again, im only talking about myself and my group. What others decide to do to live is on them.

Also, believe it or not, the Amish have planned on SHTF longer than most non Amish.
Many of them see what is going on and believe its just a matter of time before we, non Amish, destroy the earth. Whether from pollution, war, famine, disease, overpopulation.......
Many of them plan to defend their community from starving "English".

 

[BDinPutnam]

I am on the border between rural and suburban, my neighborhood is all woods with 5 acre or so plots. I like to think there are lower hanging fruit/softer targets on my block but not sure what happens after...

Either way- I'm with @Robin. Come get some.

 

[livingston]

I still don't even like the grey man idea, given a long enough SHTF even Mr Grey will become a target once the rest of the weak are weeded out. Survival of the fittest will play out in the cities pretty quick. I just seriously hate cities. Unless you hide by day and sneak about by night I think it will be sketchy in any populated area.
I really don't have a problem with everyone and their brother from the city running to the woods, when in reality they wont know the first thing to do once they get there. Hell, many people in rural areas don't know anything about the woods and would probably get lost once they got 300yds into them. These are completely different times from even 50 years ago. I don't see them surviving trying something so stupid. Those who are still passionate about being out with nature will be so much better off.

I have always held the belief that folks that never get into the woods and decide that it might be the best place will not be there long. This is what will happen ... They will here some animal crying out .. Perhaps a yote .... Have to protect themselves ... They make a big ass fire Now you don't have one person you have hundreds of small groups .. .. Now you get a hot spell woods really dry.... add that to the mix ... Half the Adirondacks could be burning at once with few people having any resources to put it out. ... Few folks will survive .... Few animals ..

 

[Jmac00]

this is why I ***HOPE*** Im already at my BOL if the SHTF, there is no road access to my BOL, it is only accessible by boat or (in the winter after the lake freezes) ATV/snowmobile.

I have everything there I need to survive, comfortably, for at least 6 months. Even in the winter, I will be fine for 6 months or so.

I'm very confident in my ability to survive. 90% of survival is mental attitude. I am GTG

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

I was thinking, in some respects I wonder if us on this forum in NY wouldn't be at a significant advantage living here than say another state.

What I mean is that gun ownership in many ways is really not "socially ok" for many in this state and gun ownership here can be very difficult. That we are most likely significantly more armed than the average ny citizen that we would be able to defend ourselves and would not be easy targets or a predators first choice .

There are literally millions of people in this state who are defenseless.

All the anti-gun bullies and liberal SJW types would be so screwed.

 

[Jmac00]

I was thinking, in some respects I wonder if us on this forum in NY wouldn't be at a significant advantage living here than say another state.

What I mean is that gun ownership in many ways is really not "socially ok" for many in this state and gun ownership here can be very difficult. That we are most likely significantly more armed than the average ny citizen that we would be able to defend ourselves and would not be easy targets or a predators first choice .

There are literally millions of people in this state who are defenseless.

All the anti-gun bullies and liberal SJW types would be so screwed.

this is what Im hoping for. an entire, entitled population not prepared for a disaster.

 

[spat]

I'm going to go for whomever presents the lowest possible potential of injury to myself. Which pretty much excludes the multicam guy if there is any other prey around. Why waste my time and resources setting up an ambush if I can find some pushover to roll with nothing more than harsh language and posturing?

Human predators are no different than animal predators in the wild. What do wovles, lions ect. look for when hunting? The old, the young, the infirm. Anyone that presents the lowest risk of a significant struggle.

On the other hand, the lone guy with the plate carrier and a nice shiny AR slung across his back looks like he has something worth taking. A head shot from an ambush position and the assailant can upgrade that old POS rifle he scrounged and you'll be dead before you even know what's happening. The guy in rags probably doesn't have anything worth the ammo to take. Though there are people out there who would beat him to death just for not having anything.

Best to be one of a couple dozen like minded individuals all outfitted with body armor and weapons.

 

[spat]

I was thinking, in some respects I wonder if us on this forum in NY wouldn't be at a significant advantage living here than say another state.

What I mean is that gun ownership in many ways is really not "socially ok" for many in this state and gun ownership here can be very difficult. That we are most likely significantly more armed than the average ny citizen that we would be able to defend ourselves and would not be easy targets or a predators first choice .

There are literally millions of people in this state who are defenseless.

All the anti-gun bullies and liberal SJW types would be so screwed.

I've thought that too.

I still plan on GTFONY within the next couple years, and my destination of choice is in AZ, so the general crowd will be far better armed than the assailants from NY would be.

If I *knew* 100% that SHTF was coming in a certain time frame, I would probably stay here and just cache a bunch of "the good stuff". I might even be tempted to keep it just across the border in a storage unit in a free state. A collapse won't happen overnight, there will be signs it's happening. I would have plenty of time to retrieve them, and this would eliminate the risks of storing them in state in the mean time.

I don't know that's coming though, so I'd rather go somewhere I can own and enjoy "the good stuff" now.

 

[Celt]

Rural if you can be self sufficient. Although you need a team/unit that can defend the homestead from the horde of slackers that are not self sufficient.

Suburban could be decent too as there is lots of scavenging to be done and less threats than an urban enviro.

Urban is the worst imo. I think that there are just too many people, not enough resources (especially water).


I think the best place to be is a rural area, not tooooo far from a suburban area for scavanging, but far enough that you can work the land and not be an area that scavangers go to look for stuff. (My folks property upstate fits this bill).

 

[livingston]

Rural if you can be self sufficient. Although you need a team/unit that can defend the homestead from the horde of slackers that are not self sufficient.

Suburban could be decent too as there is lots of scavenging to be done and less threats than an urban enviro.

Urban is the worst imo. I think that there are just too many people, not enough resources (especially water).


I think the best place to be is a rural area, not tooooo far from a suburban area for scavanging, but far enough that you can work the land and not be an area that scavangers go to look for stuff. (My folks property upstate fits this bill).

It takes a lot to be self sufficient ... And preserve what you grow . Skills have been lost . How many folks in your town have wheat stored away and more importantly a grinder to make flour. ...How many can make sourdough bread ... And have the ability to make the starter. .. Many homes today rely on a non traditional septic system .. Meaning a pump .... Grid goes down for what ever reason they are shit out of luck. ... The same with having a sump pump. ... Mold starts growing in that wet basement .... Will your home be safe to live in.....Around here hardly anyone had a good garden last year. ... Look at this year .. Coldest on record for april in Buffalo going back over 100 years. .. How many folks have heirloon seeds and have that knowledge to preserve the seeds for the next years planting. ... How about equipment to put in a garden . . I read an article once about a man down south had 7 different styles of hoes alone .. One only 2 inches wide to hoe around a corn plant . Story said he took pride in not allowing one weed in his garden of over an acre in size ... He said he loved to hoe and he spent several hours a day just hoeing .... He said it allowed him time to be by himself and think. . Back in my grandfathers time (he was a blacksmith ) All kinds of tools came to his shop to be repaired .... How many blacksmith shops are in a 25 mile radius from your home .. .. Here in Livingston county we have Genesee county museum .Genesee Country Village & Museum
One wonders will they be going full tilt during a SHTF situation ... One if they had the time can take classes ...
Genesee Country Village & Museum

 

[Celt]

@Willjr75 , and @Podmonkey

Ive spent alot of time thinking about the philosophy of being grey vs "tactical".

In public, its far better to be gray. Its best to keep your home base as gray as possible when early on in a wrol when people are out patrolling looking for places to hit.

If people scout your area, and live to tell about it, then you need to harden up, assign security that is fully kitted up, etc.. when there is no hiding then you need to be the puffed up rooster.

If you have a decent number of people on your team then you can more easily be kitted up when out patrolling/scavenging. But it really depends on so many different factors (you also need scouts who stay ahead of you to avoid being ambushed, or just caught out there). If there are other groups of people that have 40 dudes running around and you only have 20 then you have to assess how they're patrolling, and you have to adapt and adjust according to your environment, which includes enemy groups.

 

[freddy]

Here Lovell explains why you need as much ammo and as many guns as possible. Especially here in under-gunned NYS.

 

[Jmac00]

If I KNEW the Sit was about to hit the fan, I'd get my ass to my BOL as fast as I could. If it's a "surprise" situation, then I would hunker down and shelter in place. Either way I should be ok if the water stays on. I can live without Nat. gas for quite a while. WATER would be the only issue in an urban area

 

[Marine Cpl]

Here Lovell explains why you need as much ammo and as many guns as possible. Especially here in under-gunned NYS.

He clearly says the opposite on 3.45.