Cinder blocks. 9mm vs .40 vs .45

ECU Pirates

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How did I know who started this thread without even looking? Did a relative of yours get killed with a .45 acp in WW1 or something? Or did they get saved by a wool shirt? 220px-Luger19062iq.jpg

This pic gives Will a chub.
 
Marine Cpl

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ECU Pirates said:
So you work 7 days a week?
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Yes. On Saturdays and Sundays, I have go to BJ's, PetSmart, Stop and Shop, and other places as per my other boss.

That will change once my picked shift changes from nights to mornings. Then we could do those things after we both get off work during the week and have the weekends free.

The tradeoff however is, that I will see her everyday instead of just Saturdays and Sundays.
 
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Willjr75 said:
Yes. On Saturdays and Sundays, I have go to BJ's, PetSmart, Stop and Shop, and other places as per my other boss.

That will change once my picked shift changes from nights to mornings. Then we could do those things after we both get off work during the week and have the weekends free.

The tradeoff however is, that I will see her everyday instead of just Saturdays and Sundays.
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Is that trade off worth it?
 
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ECU Pirates said:
I have not looked at the videos but has anyone done 185 gr +P .45 in these tests? Or the cor bon 165 gr +P?
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Blasphemy. The number 230 gr is bigger so it must be better.

You are now trying to emulate what the smaller calibers can do but still have the capability loss issue by going lighter.
 
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carpediem

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The physics also apply to tank main guns. In some cases the smaller, longer barreled and higher velocity guns were better penetrators than the larger caliber, shorter barreled and lower velocity. Caliber is second to velocity in the penetrating world. It is still up to each of us what caliber we carry. Endless comparisons prove a point we all already know. Does it mean we will all run out and switch calibers? No. Everyone knows smoking is bad, and people still do it. It's called free will.
Doesn't that way cool junior type on youtube have a video that addresses this issue? He should if not. His word would be respected! :ROFL:
 
Marine Cpl

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ECU Pirates said:
You should. He didn't invent the .9mm though.


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I see. Perhaps I will add him to the daily rolodex of spank off material that I normally use. He can stand there next to the likenesses of Gaston Glock himself.

As far as the answer to your other question, my father's uncle's, Butler was a Marine in Guadalcanal. His Thompson was broken and the magazine could not be removed. It was relegated to being a top loader only. After the .45 ACP failed to penetrate a Jap's helmet, he ran out of ammo. Because he couldn't reload quickly enough and was limited to top loading, he was killed in action.

Because of the actions that transpired that day, my loathing for both the .45 ACP and fixed magazine became a reality.
 
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meketrefe

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These type of threads pop all over forums all the time.
The world of terminal ballistics is as complex or even more as external and internal ballistics.
I started this thread to put together a more comprehensive killing potential indicator for popular rounds
but didn't get much traction. I have put some data science into it but I have been busy with work so no
really much time to develop any further.

Ammo Killing Power

Ballistics like all other physics is a world of trade offs.
I think a huge part of the confusion is because people think that bigger, heavier is better but in the end
more times than not less becomes more. Humans are not huge and we have limited strength and capability
to carry and shoot so the trade offs proposed my modern tactics seem more reasonable.
Like Stoner once said: I have 3 requirements from the army A) weight B)weight C) weight.

Firepower, speed, penetration, weight of combat loads(firepower)... those are the current directives
that I don't think are going to change that much.

The chinese hit the nail in the head with their relatively new 6mm service ammo for the MBR. We could
easily do the same with a slightly beefed up 6x45 or even a 6.8 neck down to 6mm. This will give extra bite
yet will preserve weight, firepower, speed as required by modern tactics.

For pistols the same thing. A 9x23 would be perfect but cannot justify the migration from 9mm specially with
the latest pistols and high performance ammo. for everything else there is the 357SIG, 9x25 and even the
10mm that is a hand full already. I think a 10mm glock is a perfect gun for big bear territory and the artic
and a lot more effective than most revolvers. It might be too much for PD for some but it has many benefits.

Like always speed is key. I would like to have a 45 in a super compact pistol. If cannot develop the speed then
at least send some grain. that is a good use for that imo but for me will not justify going back to 45 with all
that entitles. I can also see some people like to consolidate and might even have a lever action 45 for hunting
at close ranges. Nothing wrong with that but for the new folks is good to know there are better and more modern
cartridges for all those roles.

IMO people need to learn how to love the calibers for what they are and not what they are not.
If someone loves the 45 colt why not shoot that? Who are we to say one should not like cowboy action,
classic 1911 or whatever one likes?
A different story is when folks try to justify some of these in critical duty scenarios. Again not that they
cannot be used, anything can be the right tool specially if one likes it but from there to defend that this
is the best alternative for modern tactics and needs that can become quite a stretch.

Although we all have a bit of old uncle Clint inside. LOL

Get off my loan!


 
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Yea. If you like the .45 and it makes you feel manly or sexy..... That's cool. But don't go around saying that it'll penetrate something it can't or that capacity doesn't matter in a gunfight.
 
gun_slinger_boy

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It's not about feeling manly or sexy. It's that no one cares. I carry a bulgarian makarov. How is that for manly? It's even "less effective" than the legendary 9mm. But I like the reliability of it. I also like the small size and the weight of it (yes I like that it's heavier for a small gun). I shoot it well and know it's more than enough to get the job done. I also live in America and can put a drum magazine on it if I wanted. We've all seen the videos and read the ballistics reports. We've discussed this stuff ad nauseum and know what the rounds do. But we will use what we want to use.
 
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gun_slinger_boy said:
It's not about feeling manly or sexy. It's that no one cares. I carry a bulgarian makarov. How is that for manly? It's even "less effective" than the legendary 9mm. But I like the reliability of it. I also like the small size and the weight of it (yes I like that it's heavier for a small gun). I shoot it well and know it's more than enough to get the job done. I also live in America and can put a drum magazine on it if I wanted. We've all seen the videos and read the ballistics reports. We've discussed this stuff ad nauseum and know what the rounds do. But we will use what we want to use.
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That's great. I can agree with that.
 
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