Help me... 9 mm vs 45 ACP

[meketrefe]

The shorter the barrel the 45 with grain makes more sense like a 3" barrel but I would not sacrifice firepower (round count) vs grain.
In a mid and large frame pistol the 9mm starts to make more sense(speed vs grain) specially is you can keep a lighter gun with more firepower up to 18+1 rounds depending where you live or if you are a proviledged citizen.
Or simply pick the one you shoot better with and like the most that is the most important thing specially if you are substantially better with a specific gun and ammo combination.
Train a lot. That is also your top priority.

 

[Chevusa]

Keep in mind in a defensive shooting your target will be between 1 inch and a few feet away from you. Any more than that and you're going to have some explaining to do. So to make the argument that someone would be firing off rounds all over the place and not get shots on target is a little silly. I shoot my small 9mm's about the same as my bigger .40. The longer barrel of the .40 might be the offsetting factor I'm not sure. I would suspect the .45 would fall right between the other two. You don't need to be a bullseye shooter. It won't translate to a real life situation. You're not a sniper.

 

[Robin]

You bring up another question I’ve been thinking about... Are there any ranges in CNY that offer rentals? I’m guessing our omniscient Gov has deemed them too risky and banned them. I’ve Googled it and came up empty.

I have never been there but I have heard tell that they do offer rentals and have a large selection.

The Firing Pin in Bergen , NY

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Robin

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Child's play.

View attachment 59480

Well mine's bigger than yours!

ETA: Reloading makes feeding this about 40 cents per.

 

[dsdmmat]

Keep in mind in a defensive shooting your target will be between 1 inch and a few feet away from you. Any more than that and you're going to have some explaining to do. So to make the argument that someone would be firing off rounds all over the place and not get shots on target is a little silly. I shoot my small 9mm's about the same as my bigger .40. The longer barrel of the .40 might be the offsetting factor I'm not sure. I would suspect the .45 would fall right between the other two. You don't need to be a bullseye shooter. It won't translate to a real life situation. You're not a sniper.

There are a whole lot of gunfights that end without anyone getting shot. The saying goes, in a knife fight someone always gets cut, in a gunfight people don’t always get shot.

You cannot count on being so close you don’t have to aim, 0-21 feet is the typical self defense zone recognized by expert witnesses in court proceedings.

In a gun fight, adrenaline will flood your system, you will get tunnel vision and your ability to shoot will be hampered if, you have not practiced stress firing.

stress firing practice can be practiced a lot of ways. I usually practice with a timer because the buzzer sounding makes my heart pump faster as I am trying to accomplish something on the clock.

 

[Darth]

Well mine's bigger than yours!

I've heard that one before.

5 year olds can be so hurtful sometimes. :'(

 

[Phauxtoe]

9mm is way cheaper, you will get to shoot more!
more rounds down range makes me happier!

 

[pramaglia]

If you are used to the Beretta and comfortable with a DA/SA pistol, you should check out the CZ P-01 or CZ 2075 Rami BD. Both are good for concealed carry and both are DA/SA like the Beretta. I have the P-01 and find it pretty easy to conceal. If you want a striker fired pistol then the Sig P365 is a nice choice. Just my opinion.

 

[Chevusa]

I want a P365 but I have a G43 and G43X so it's hard for me to justify. I'm not very responsible with money so I'll post a pic when I get it

 

[Criticalt]

There are a whole lot of gunfights end without anyone getting shot. The saying goes, in a knife fight someone always gets cut, in a gunfight people don’t always get shot.

You cannot count on being so close you don’t have to aim, 0-21 feet is the typical self defense zone recognized by expert witnesses in court proceedings.

In a gun fight, adrenaline will flood your system, you will get tunnel vision and your ability to shoot will be hampered if, you have not practiced stress firing.

stress firing practice can be practiced a lot of ways. I usually practice with a timer because the buzzer sounding makes my heart pump faster as I am trying to accomplish something on the clock.

Ive watched soooo many videos on the "Active Self Prorection" Youtube channel where 2 guys standing within feet of each other fire off 6 rounds each and nobody gets shot. Its truely amazing how poorly many people shoot during a life and death situation.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

This is like asking what's the "best" deer cartridge. I think you might be putting the cart before the horse.

I'd handle some pistols, see what felt good in my hand, what would be comfortable and discreet on my person first, then worry about cartridge. There's a lot of cartridges out there that would very likely stop a threat to life and/or serious injury at 6 feet.

 

[Twogunwilly]

I say .40 is more powerful and more effective than 9mm or .45, who's with me?

Debate settled.

 

[nortatoga]

 

[Podmonkey]

Even restricted to 10 rounds the 9mm has many advantages, chief among them increased ease of accurate follow up shots. While good for carry I don't like any type of 2 fingered grip pistol to be suitable for recreational or completion shooting so a gun like the Glock 48 which offers a full grip without the stigma of "wasted space" to be very compelling.
Ballisticly speaking the .45 can't do anything the 9mm can't. You have to step up to 10mm before you get a meaningful increase in power.

 

[AnthonyC]

Talking about 7 or 10 rounds, in regards how many rounds you can have in the mag when you carry, it's not quite so simple as some portray.

The law is still on the books, a cop can still arrest you for (and probably will), a DA can still try to prosecute you (and probably will). Now you may not be convicted but that's after a lot of your time and money. Remember, the DA isn't spending his money but you certainly will have to spend yours for a good lawyer.

This article may be helpful: How many rounds, 7 or 10?

It's 10 rounds, not 7. Go 9mm. Get the P365.

For starters, you're not limited to 7 rounds, it's ten.

Second, I wouldn't suggest getting rid of a home defense gun you're familiar with just to get a EDC gun you have to start all over with. Even if you never touch the 96 again, you'll regret it at some point if you were to sell.

As for the gun, ignore 45, there's no point at all. Velocities are lower, recoil is different, and you make just as big a hole with an expanding 9mm as you do with a decent 45.

If you're buying a new gun get the regular p365. However if you're really going to get rid of the 96(don't) get a p320 so you can switch from full size to compact in the future.

Also, thank you for clearing up my confusion about the round capacity.

 

[Marine Cpl]

The DA cannot overrule a circuit court appeal. Period. That’s why they aren’t convicting anyone. That’s why police have been instructed not to charge based on what the penal law says. The penal law remains however to disuade people who don’t know how the courts work.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Talking about 7 or 10 rounds, in regards how many rounds you can have in the mag when you carry, it's not quite so simple as some portray.

The law is still on the books, a cop can still arrest you for (and probably will), a DA can still try to prosecute you (and probably will). Now you may not be convicted but that's after a lot of your time and money. Remember, the DA isn't spending his money but you certainly will have to spend yours for a good lawyer.

This article may be helpful: How many rounds, 7 or 10?
View attachment 59576 View attachment 59576

That article is old news. There has been a 2nd Circuit Court ruling affirming Skretney’s decision.

 

[Chevusa]

Talking about 7 or 10 rounds, in regards how many rounds you can have in the mag when you carry, it's not quite so simple as some portray.

The law is still on the books, a cop can still arrest you for (and probably will), a DA can still try to prosecute you (and probably will). Now you may not be convicted but that's after a lot of your time and money. Remember, the DA isn't spending his money but you certainly will have to spend yours for a good lawyer.

This article may be helpful: How many rounds, 7 or 10?
View attachment 59576 View attachment 59576

Not where I live. Or the surrounding counties. The DA's have publicly stated on record there will be no cases heard. Also in Erie County the Sheriff has law abiding gun owner's backs. Who is the highest law enforcement official in the county? State police? Nope. Local police? Nope. FBI? Nope. It's the Sheriff. He's the only elected law enforcement official. It goes back to the Old West. Everyone else operates in the county at his pleasure.

 

[stuckhere]

The usual caliber debates like this are annoying to participate in. However, when it's a 10rd state like ours, it is worth discussing IMO.

If we were in a non capacity limited area, I would be firmly in the 9mm camp. And for transparency, my available choices as of now are Glock 42, 43 and 48. So clearly a .355 fan. And for most people, they are acceptably comforted by standard 9x19.

But there is something to discover when you analyze all of the details and ask all of the small questions. Strictly speaking of the daily carry role, there is rational application in many peoples rotation for .357 Sig, .40 and .45

 

[dsdmmat]

When in AZ I carried 67 rounds of 38 super. Here I carry 22 rounds of 45 (190 JHC grain super-vel)

 

[SigFan]

This is The heart of my OP...
Thanks for the reply.

The usual caliber debates like this are annoying to participate in. However, when it's a 10rd state like ours, it is worth discussing IMO.

If we were in a non capacity limited area, I would be firmly in the 9mm camp. And for transparency, my available choices as of now are Glock 42, 43 and 48. So clearly a .355 fan. And for most people, they are acceptably comforted by standard 9x19.

But there is something to discover when you analyze all of the details and ask all of the small questions. Strictly speaking of the daily carry role, there is rational application in many peoples rotation for .357 Sig, .40 and .45

 

[1911guy]

You'll have to guess what I would suggest.

 

[SigFan]

.32ACP or .22 Mag?

You'll have to guess what I would suggest.

 

[fresch]

The Best Hard-Working Tactical Tomahawks

Mil-spec hatchets.

hiconsumption.com

 

[Nevar]

Hands down the Best Caliber to use for self defense . Is the One you are comfy and good with .
That said Funny that all the Calibers are compared to the King and Queen [ in no order] .45ACP .357mag.

 

[Chevusa]

My buddy is on SWAT. The non-SWAT officers all carry .40S&W while the guys and girl on SWAT carry .45ACP (they let SWAT carry what they want). They have had to take out aggressive dogs going into these houses over the years and he said without a doubt the damage done by the .45 is a lot more devastating. I won't get too graphic but there were big exit holes and lots off things that used to be attached that weren't anyone. Still not quite the mess the Benelli 12GA with 3" magnums made though.

 

[Bob]

Get the gun that you shoot best and you can carry always.

/thread

 

[Marine Cpl]

With a low velocity pistol, hole sizes whether entry, internal, or exit is not what stops you. It’s penetration to vitals that’ll stop you.

You don’t shoot someone to die later. So a smaller hole that is a millimeter or 2 smaller with slightly lower blood loss is irrelevant. Who cares if shot in the gut with a .45 compared to a 9mm results in a death of 10 minutes later vs 8 minutes later for example. It’s just flesh bleeding. Bleeding flesh doesn’t kill you quickly.

Only vitals struck kill you quickly. And whether a vital is struck with with a diameter of .355 vs .450 is irrelevant.

Energy, shock, etc is only relevant when it comes to rifles because the shockwave is so large that it can shut down vitals that aren’t hit.

 

[Nevar]

Agree but the .45 has A hell of A lot more mass.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Agree but the .45 has A hell of A lot more mass.

But mass alone doesn’t kill you. It’s what gets hit that does. Mass is only a factor that leads to penetration depths in tissue.

Your heart isn’t going to care if a 255 gr bullet pierced it clean through compared to a 124 gr that pierced it clean through. Depending on what the target it, at a certain point, mass is irrelevant. In a human, the heart either gets pierced or it doesn’t. Both will reach it.

With a bigger body like bear for example, the higher mass will penetrate further and that’s when it becomes relevant.