Robin
.475 A&M Magnum
The Government should err on the side of the constitution.
You're a good little subject.
Robin
Maryland SWAT Team Serving Red Flag Warrant Shoot, Kill 21-Year-Old Man Asleep In His Bed
- Thread starter PutnamCharlie
- Start date
You're a good little subject.
Robin
GOYABEAN
.950 JDJ
Yeah where is he I PM but nothing
If a few cops die from a family member protecting their property, you're good with that too correct?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
I don’t care about legitimate perps. I care about the innocent. The innocent mother and dog that can be shot due to her perp son. The girlfriend sleeping over due to her prohibited boyfriend being tipped against from someone who may have had an argument with him. Someone like me who may be No Knocked against for a post I make rather than being approached about it like most good PD’s just end up doing.
The point is and I'm sure that you know, most of these NO Knocks aren’t absolutely necessary. I’m sure your department has apprehended a newly prohibited person due to a DV without ESU by approaching and or apprehending him normally.
Not everyone that needs to be apprehended needs to be via violent action through a busted door or broken window in the middle of the night. Most get apprehended at work, in their car, or by a knock on the door. Your department apprehends most people without ESU raids.
Celt
.450/400 Nitro Ex
I hope not. For their sake..
Please back up this fear mongering wildly inflated claim with evidence.
It would be nice to live in fantasy land. The founders didn't envision meth labs.
You wouldn't know which way is up after the flash bang goes off. It's fun to day dream though.I hope not. For their sake..
You don't know the facts of this or any other SWAT operation. Let's let the pro's who have to risk their lives decide what it necessary.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
I do not need to. Unless you are saying that every raid takes place with no one else inside the house but the one single perp they are looking for and never is an innocent person in there in danger that could be shot. Never. Right.
And for the most part they do. Most departments don’t use No Knocks unless absolutely necessary and when they do it’s because it’s eminent. For the most part there is a knock on the door.
But some departments are starting to use them for non eminent situations. IE the OP. His girlfriend and parents were in harms way. Unless of course you are saying that they weren’t in danger and they had evidence that he was going to shoot up a place in the morning. None of the police reports even remotely allude to that. They all say that the reason was because he may have been in possession of firearms as a prohibited person. That clearly isn’t a situation of absolute eminence and you know it.
Yea, be good little subjects. The gov knows what's best for you. This country it fucked. This post just shows that the gov is not longer for the people by the people.
Instead of taking a thread like this and trying to help us understand you tell us to try the gov and when we say that's not good enough you talk to us like children and serfs. This is exactly why we dont trust gov or many of its employees.
Robin
.475 A&M Magnum
At first when I read some of your postings on a variety of other subjects I just figured you were of a differing opinion. Now, I believe you must be some kind of weird troll, no one is that unintentionally stupid and is able to use the internet. Do you have andy's dick prints on your lips?
Robin
When feeding the trolls, Please remember keep it civil.
Celt
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Where is the meth lab in this story?
Acer-m14
20×102mm Vulcan
from what i read in some of the news of this they tossed in a flash bang .. so your not hearing shit .. you have no clue who it is ..
Acer-m14
20×102mm Vulcan
smoking and injecting poison ivy is legal .. what is worse Meth or Poison Ivy ??
Wow. This thread has pretty much deteriorated into "if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear" and "comply at all times and maybe the .gov won't kill you".
that someone is actually able to sit there and argue that the .gov knows best, and should ignore the Constitution when it suits them (ie: when THEY deem it necessary) is absolutely disgusting.
But, if I recall my history correctly, there were Jews who even helped the S.S. So our resident Stasi should feel quite at home.
might as well lock this thread, Mods. It's not going anywhere at this point.
that someone is actually able to sit there and argue that the .gov knows best, and should ignore the Constitution when it suits them (ie: when THEY deem it necessary) is absolutely disgusting.
But, if I recall my history correctly, there were Jews who even helped the S.S. So our resident Stasi should feel quite at home.
might as well lock this thread, Mods. It's not going anywhere at this point.
Celt
.450/400 Nitro Ex
I was just following orders.
You're right. This child sure doesn't.
Doesn't sound like a daydream, more like a nightmare
Ex-Georgia Deputy Acquitted After Flash Bang Grenade Injures Toddler
A former Georgia deputy was acquitted Friday of lying to a judge in connection with a drug raid last year that left a toddler critically injured.
www.nbcnews.com
Jmac00
.475 A&M Magnum
96coal449
.308 Win
Let's leave this open please.
We may actually learn the truth behind the cover ups ...... at some point.
That's the number of raids. The wild claim was that there was mass people being shot in these raids. Still waiting for this claim to be backed by evidence.
Your argument is that there shouldn't be SWAT raids. The founders didn't envision crime like we have today. The raids are limited, legal, and will continue. I've never seen so many people worried over nothing. Fits the stereotypical "gun nuts clutching their guns waiting for the government to come" that we already have to deal with. Why throw more fuel on the fire? The SWAT team isn't knocking down your door, relax.
PutnamCharlie
6.5 Creedmoor
Statistics[edit]
The number of no-knock raids has increased from 3,000 in 1981 to more than 50,000 in 2005, according to Peter Kraska, a criminologist at Eastern Kentucky University in Richmond.[4] Raids that lead to deaths of innocent people are increasingly common; since the early 1980s, forty bystanders have been killed, according to the Cato Institute in Washington, D.C.[4]
In Utah, no-knock warrants make up about 40% of all warrants served.[1] In Maryland, 90% of SWAT deployments were to serve search warrants, with two-thirds through forced entry.[1]
From 2010 through 2016, at least 81 civilians and 13 officers died during SWAT raids, including 31 civilians and eight officers during execution of no-knock warrants.[1] Half of the civilians killed were members of a minority.[1] Of those subject to SWAT search warrants, 42% are black and 12% are Hispanic.[1] Since 2011, at least seven federal lawsuits against officers executing no-knock warrants have been settled for over $1 million.[1]
Other examples[edit]
The number of no-knock raids has increased from 3,000 in 1981 to more than 50,000 in 2005, according to Peter Kraska, a criminologist at Eastern Kentucky University in Richmond.[4] Raids that lead to deaths of innocent people are increasingly common; since the early 1980s, forty bystanders have been killed, according to the Cato Institute in Washington, D.C.[4]
In Utah, no-knock warrants make up about 40% of all warrants served.[1] In Maryland, 90% of SWAT deployments were to serve search warrants, with two-thirds through forced entry.[1]
From 2010 through 2016, at least 81 civilians and 13 officers died during SWAT raids, including 31 civilians and eight officers during execution of no-knock warrants.[1] Half of the civilians killed were members of a minority.[1] Of those subject to SWAT search warrants, 42% are black and 12% are Hispanic.[1] Since 2011, at least seven federal lawsuits against officers executing no-knock warrants have been settled for over $1 million.[1]
Other examples[edit]
- Kathryn Johnston (1914–2006) was an elderly Atlanta, Georgia, woman shot by three undercover police officers in her home on November 21, 2006, after she fired one shot at the ceiling, assuming her home was being invaded. While the officers were wounded by friendly fire, none of the officers received life-threatening injuries, but Johnston was killed by their gunfire.[4]
- Two former Los Angeles Police Department officers, along with 13 others, have plead guilty to running a robbery ring, which used fake no-knock raids as a ruse to catch victims off guard. The defendants would then steal cash and drugs to sell on the street.[9][10]
- Tracy Ingle was shot in his house five times during a no-knock raid in North Little Rock, Arkansas. After the police entered the house Tracy thought armed robbers had entered the house and intended to scare them away with a non-working gun. The police expected to find drugs, but none were found. He was brought to the intensive care, but police pulled him out of intensive care for questioning, after which they arrested him and charged him with assault on the officers who shot him.[11][12]
- Ismael Mena was shot and killed by SWAT team officers in Denver, Colorado, who were performing a no-knock raid that was approved by a judge acting on false information contained in a search warrant. The police believed there to be drugs in the house, but no drugs were found on the premises, and it was later revealed that the address given to the SWAT team by officer Joseph Bini was the wrong one. Jefferson County District Attorney Dave Thomas investigated the matter and cleared the officers involved with the raid on the grounds that Mena had pointed a gun and fired it at SWAT officers, although who fired first remains in dispute. However, many have objected to the investigation's findings due to inconsistencies in the various officers' account of what happened. The American Civil Liberties Union and others have objected to the Denver Police Department's request for a no-knock raid and the judge's decision to allow such a raid, on the grounds that they failed to meet the criteria necessary for such an operation.[13]
- A Georgia SWAT team shot and killed an armed homeowner, David Hooks, during a drug raid sparked by the word of a self-confessed meth addict and burglar who had robbed the property the previous day. David Hooks' wife, Teresa, looked outside and saw people with hoods on the evening of the raid and woke up her husband. Fearing the burglar or burglars who had struck two nights earlier had returned, Hooks armed himself. Despite the fact that the search warrant did not have a 'no knock' clause, the Drug Task Force and SRT members broke down the back door of the family's home and entered, firing in excess of 16 shots. There is no evidence that David Hooks ever fired a weapon, nor was there any evidence he was involved in drugs. The Georgia Bureau of Investigation conducted an intensive 44-hour search of the property and came up with not one item of contraband.[14]
- Hempstead, New York settled claims by Iyanna Davis for $650,000 after police in May 2010 shot her in the breast during their accidental execution of a no-knock warrant on the wrong address. Officer Michael Capobianco explained that he had unintentionally shot the 22-year-old woman after he tripped. Prosecutors did not file charges against the shooter.[1]
- A Burleson County, Texas grand jury refused to indict Hank Magee for capital murder after he shot and killed a deputy sheriff inside his home during execution of a no-knock warrant on December 19, 2013.[15]
- In Killeen, Texas, a grand jury indicted Marvin Louis Guy for capital murder after he shot and killed a police detective outside his home during execution of a no-knock warrant on May 9, 2014.[15]
- In 2013, Tucson, Arizona agreed to settle claims by the family of Jose Guereña for $3.4 million after SWAT officers fired 71 shots in the seven seconds after their unannounced entry. Prosecutors did not file charges against the shooters.[1]
- In December 2016, a jury in Corpus Christi, Texas acquitted Ray Rosas of attempted capital murder because it concluded that he was unaware the three home intruders he shot were SWAT officers. Prior to his acquittal, Rosas had spent 664 days in jail.[1]
- In 2016, Framingham, Massachusetts agreed to settle claims by the family of Eurie Stamps for $3.75 million after SWAT officers shot the 68-year-old in the back while he was compliant and lying on his stomach. Prosecutors did not file charges against the shooter.[1]
- On February 6, 2019, Milwaukee Police Department officer Matthew Rittner was shot and killed while conducting a no-knock raid. The shooter, Jordan P. Fricke, was charged with first-degree intentional homicide
So over 6 years 81 people out of 327.4 million got shot. Now how many were criminals posing a deadly threat to the officers? Or is your argument that not even they should be shot when it is deemed a legal self defense? If so please turn in your pistol permit and other weapons as you should not be entitled to self defense because your position is the police should not either.
Jmac00
.475 A&M Magnum
there is an average of 20K "no knock" raids every year, many civilians pay the price, sometimes the cops pay the price, how many people must die in an UNNECESSARY raid? is one enough for you, or 20? There are examples all over the internet of raids gone wrong.
Houston Police To Cease 'No Knock' Warrants, Chief Announces After Deadly Raid
"I'm very confident that we're going to have criminal charges on one or more police officers" from a raid that left two suspects dead, Houston Police Chief Art Acevedo said.
www.npr.org
Cops do 20,000 no-knock raids a year. Civilians often pay the price when they go wrong.
Vox is a general interest news site for the 21st century. Its mission: to help everyone understand our complicated world, so that we can all help shape it. In text, video and audio, our reporters explain politics, policy, world affairs, technology, culture, science, the climate crisis, money...
www.vox.com
not to mention how many family pets are killed by the police. Imagine how vicious a 15" Beagle must be?
96coal449
.308 Win
Wayco
See my post right above yours. It would appear very few innocents "pay the price". Not everything is going to be perfect. Just like the democrats want to legislate crazy gun laws "if only they would save 1 life". Well if we need to worry about the tiny minority, then we should ban cars "if only to save 1 life" and flying in airplanes "if only 1 person could be saved". How far should we go with it?there is an average of 20K "no knock" raids every year, many civilians pay the price, sometimes the cops pay the price, how many people must die in an UNNECESSARY raid? is one enough for you, or 20? There are examples all over the internet of raids gone wrong.
Houston Police To Cease 'No Knock' Warrants, Chief Announces After Deadly Raid
"I'm very confident that we're going to have criminal charges on one or more police officers" from a raid that left two suspects dead, Houston Police Chief Art Acevedo said.
Cops do 20,000 no-knock raids a year. Civilians often pay the price when they go wrong.
Vox is a general interest news site for the 21st century. Its mission: to help everyone understand our complicated world, so that we can all help shape it. In text, video and audio, our reporters explain politics, policy, world affairs, technology, culture, science, the climate crisis, money...
not to mention how many family pets are killed by the police. Imagine how vicious a 15" Beagle must be?
Jmac00
.475 A&M Magnum
PutnamCharlie
6.5 Creedmoor
I bet if one of those people were a family member you would have a different perspective.